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I am sorry...if you want me to leave, i will.


djmaxfactor1995
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Max Factor: Yay or Nay  

19 members have voted

  1. 1. Do you think that Max (Factor) should remain a member of psynews.org?



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Alright, well, I'm out of this thread.

 

I'm a practicing Shakta in an ultra-traditional guru lineage from W. Bengal, and I'm more committed to that than I am any music scene - especially one with arrogant folks like DJMax whatever. Spirituality and religion is my life; trance comes second. The fact that I'm into both goa and hinduism is a coincidence anyway; I'm not too fond of the surface-level-attraction to eastern religion that most goa displays.

 

I learned long ago that I have nothing to prove and no-one to convert... and that said, I also have no reason to dialogue with people who disagree as to the nature of religion when their minds are already made up and hateful.

 

Sorry, guys. I've got priorities... maybe I'll be back when I release some tracks.

 

Peace.

 

GoaArtist&DJ&DurgaDevoteeJasonPandanandi2005

 

 

Thread derailed completely. Keep this genre/religion/drug crap out of this thread and make a new one for it in an appropriate section if you so wish. The thread is about what is wrong with goatrance musical-wise today. Thanks.

 

This especially applies to you, max. Also do use the multiquote button, everyone else can, why can't you? .

 

Edit: If you have problems with the forums functionality please direct questions here:

http://www.psynews.o...post__p__977841

 

 

Thread derailed completely. Keep this genre/religion/drug crap out of this thread and make a new one for it in an appropriate section if you so wish. The thread is about what is wrong with goatrance musical-wise today. Thanks.

 

This especially applies to you, max. Also do use the multiquote button, everyone else can, why can't you? .

 

Edit: If you have problems with the forums functionality please direct questions here:

http://www.psynews.o...post__p__977841

 

Okay sorry everyone. Especially all of you that i offended. I am not good at engaging with others. I thought that was well-known. I can't blame it on something like, Turet's .. I am just an asshole, sometimes. But, I still believe my behavior is the essence of human. We all make mistakes, all the time, the issue is two-fold. First we are in denial of these mistakes and two, we don't claim them as ours. We blame some other person or situation. Am I completely barbaric? Can anyone relate? At least Penzoline writes to me directly instead of in the third person. Thank you, Penzoline. I don't really understand the proper use of the multiquote button and why I need to use it. Correct me, but isn't that to reply to more than one person? What, technically did I do wrong? I know that I am offensive, rude, insensitive, and all that. Again, my deepest apologies. As for my religious negativity. I did not mean it. I just meant to seek separation from the journey that many of us share with this music. And, I believe that you have the right to believe whatever you want. As long as it does not interfere with the beliefs of others.

Jason Panandandi: This quote

'm a practicing Shakta in an ultra-traditional guru lineage from W. Bengal, and I'm more committed to that than I am any music scene - especially one with arrogant folks like DJMax whatever. Spirituality and religion is my life; trance comes second. The fact that I'm into both goa and Hinduism is a coincidence anyway; I'm not too fond of the surface-level-attraction to eastern religion that most goa displays.

 

The deeper part of your belief, I have no right to judge, or dispel. I am truly sorry. I did not mean anything to you, personally. But, you are a practicing Hindu and you admitted that you are not fond of the superficial bond that goa trance and Hinduism perpetuates. Thank you. I did not know that is was offensive as I suggested. You have given support to my instinct that it must be a slap in the face to have your religion spewed all over with no regard for sanctuary or ritual. That is exactly what I was hoping you could teach me. If we both are strong believers in this music and you are also a strong believer of Hinduism. Look how close we are to actually talking as intelligent humans on the subject. If you would like to help me understand your faith. I would love to hear it. Again, I don't believe that escaping a situation is always best. Another quote:

I learned long ago that I have nothing to prove and no-one to convert... and that said, I also have no reason to dialogue with people who disagree as to the nature of religion when their minds are already made up and hateful.

I think that you have already decided that you hate me... Emotions do not help us uncover the truth. So You cut me off immediately and you label me as arrogant and close minded and hateful. I do not hate you, I do not disagree as to the true nature of religion, and I am have not made up my mind about anything. But, one thing that can not help me is an emotionally unbalanced state. I hope that when you are not upset, you will pm me. So I can learn from you.

One last thing....If you all want me out, please vote yes.

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I wish you would slow down a little bit, and take the time to meditate/contemplate by silencing the

internal dialogue, and perhaps imagining what it is you wish to accomplish.

 

Dialogue/conversations are like waves, they don't happen all-at-once, so give conversation/dialogue a

chance, be patient, listen to others, explain very very carefully why you write what you do, expect to

be misunderstood but don't take it personally, and above realise that experiences and things that maybe

be obviously, just so to you, aren't necessarily for other people.

 

And please try and not confuse your opinion/experiences/thoughts for "how it is™". As Korzybski pointed out

"the map is not the territory."

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You asked the question in such a way that "Yes" means "stay"... but it's ok. Truthfully, I'm ambivalent. It's whatever, I guess.

I haven't made up my mind to hate you. I'm not too big on the whole hate thing (anger is another story altogether; it's justified sometimes.) That said... you said in this post that you weren't trying to offend religion, just to separate it from Goa Trance... fair enough, if it were true, but in fact, you said all sorts of hateful things. Mostly the "horrific [religion] of inequality and murder" comment. One's true colors are shown in comments like these.

 

But... it's ok. Like you said, we can all be assholes. You're welcome to think that religions are control mechanisms. I disagree with you completely and in fact think that sanctity is the "one thing needful"... but we can agree to disagree. I don't talk about my religion around here because it's not what I'm here for... I'm here to be a goa trance musician and fan. But if we're going to talk about it... don't be an ass about it. I could say all sorts of negative things about your viewpoint, but I try to be friendly most of the time. Concede me (and others) the same.

 

And as for the whole Goa Trance + Eastern Symbolism thing... it's a bit offensive to me and everyone else that actually practices some of those things seriously, but at the same time, I don't mind it that much. It's part of Goa Trance, like it or not... and I like goa trance as a whole, in spite of the annoying stuff.

 

Boy, it's really hard keeping a straight face when I try telling someone I practice an eastern religion seriously when they already know I love goa trance. Loving goa trance means "not very serious" about hinduism/buddhism/whatever most of the time. XD

 

tl;dr:

Don't be an ass.

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I wish you would slow down a little bit, and take the time to meditate/contemplate by silencing the

internal dialogue, and perhaps imagining what it is you wish to accomplish.

 

Dialogue/conversations are like waves, they don't happen all-at-once, so give conversation/dialogue a

chance, be patient, listen to others, explain very very carefully why you write what you do, expect to

be misunderstood but don't take it personally, and above realise that experiences and things that maybe

be obviously, just so to you, aren't necessarily for other people.

 

And please try and not confuse your opinion/experiences/thoughts for "how it is™". As Korzybski pointed out

"the map is not the territory."

 

 

You asked the question in such a way that "Yes" means "stay"... but it's ok. Truthfully, I'm ambivalent. It's whatever, I guess.

I haven't made up my mind to hate you. I'm not too big on the whole hate thing (anger is another story altogether; it's justified sometimes.) That said... you said in this post that you weren't trying to offend religion, just to separate it from Goa Trance... fair enough, if it were true, but in fact, you said all sorts of hateful things. Mostly the "horrific [religion] of inequality and murder" comment. One's true colors are shown in comments like these.

 

But... it's ok. Like you said, we can all be assholes. You're welcome to think that religions are control mechanisms. I disagree with you completely and in fact think that sanctity is the "one thing needful"... but we can agree to disagree. I don't talk about my religion around here because it's not what I'm here for... I'm here to be a goa trance musician and fan. But if we're going to talk about it... don't be an ass about it. I could say all sorts of negative things about your viewpoint, but I try to be friendly most of the time. Concede me (and others) the same.

 

And as for the whole Goa Trance + Eastern Symbolism thing... it's a bit offensive to me and everyone else that actually practices some of those things seriously, but at the same time, I don't mind it that much. It's part of Goa Trance, like it or not... and I like goa trance as a whole, in spite of the annoying stuff.

 

Boy, it's really hard keeping a straight face when I try telling someone I practice an eastern religion seriously when they already know I love goa trance. Loving goa trance means "not very serious" about hinduism/buddhism/whatever most of the time. XD

 

tl;dr:

Don't be an ass.

 

Thank you, Gentleman. I will do better.

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I think it's up to you to decide for yourself if you want to stay here (as long as you act accordingly to the rules). :) No poll can do that for you imho. Btw. if you want to discuss stuff that is not directly related to psytrance (the music I mean), like drugs, philosophy or religion, you can use the off-topic part of the forum.

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No, I'd rather you didn't leave. You do provide some very interesting opinions that you are obviously passionate about.

 

Just try and do a few simple things & I think you'll find your stay here more enjoyable:

 

-Caps lock off.

-If you want to continue a discussion brought up in a thread, that is not about the topic of the thread, then start a new thread about it.

-If you want to discuss non-music related topics then use the off topic section, you'll get more responses.

-If you are a drug user, try not to come here when really high (same for really drunk) as posts often come out badly.

-Enjoy.

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You should, stay. Especially because this forum needs more interesting topics and new users and it's really nice to see that every day we can read a lot new topics and posts. Only thing you should avoid in the future is to posting in wrong threads, for example Neogoa - problems topic isn't really a good place for drug and spirituality stuff, it's more about music/production and development of genre itself /that is my opinion and perception of that topic.

 

Plus, small advice for next posts, try to type your posts in ''fragments'', it's hard to read 30 sentences one after another, without any breaks between them. ;)

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You should stay, every one of us has an unique point of view. That's why forums exist: a place where we can see, and learn, when we meet. But then, there are some subjects that are present in psychedelic trance, but we should be very careful when mixing - say - sex and psy trance in the same conversation. The same for politics, religion, drugs. And as someone said above, don't feel offended by us. Offense and negativism are the blood of any forum :D

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Stay and keep believing what you believe. People who take a personal offense when someone example criticize religion are oversensitive (Just look how the world call the danish director Lars Von Trier -. a danish left wing humanist - a Nazi because people do not want to listen to what it was he actually said. "Hollywood" got offended and the world followed their command) . I too find the religious symbols in this scene out of place. But each to his own.

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Just look how the world call the danish director Lars Von Trier -. a danish left wing humanist - a Nazi because people do not want to listen to what it was he actually said.

 

To be fair, one of the things he actually said was "I'm a Nazi".

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You should stay, every one of us has an unique point of view. That's why forums exist: a place where we can see, and learn, when we meet. But then, there are some subjects that are present in psychedelic trance, but we should be very careful when mixing - say - sex and psy trance in the same conversation. The same for politics, religion, drugs. And as someone said above, don't feel offended by us. Offense and negativism are the blood of any forum :D

 

politics, religion, and drugs. the big three no-no's Well if I say yes-yes to one of them and no-no to the other two does that make it okay?

 

Stay and keep believing what you believe. People who take a personal offense when someone example criticize religion are oversensitive (Just look how the world call the danish director Lars Von Trier -. a danish left wing humanist - a Nazi because people do not want to listen to what it was he actually said. "Hollywood" got offended and the world followed their command) . I too find the religious symbols in this scene out of place. But each to his own.

 

The whole anti-Semitic thing is so overplayed. I mean it is such a fallback. Anyone that knows what it is too be Jewish, knows that Jews are self-hating. That is the big irony of it all. Haven't you heard the term, "Self-hating Jew?" Well that means that all Jews are anti-Semites, in a way. Only humorless gentiles act so sensitive on this subject. Hilarious. The thing that Lars said about being rude and and sarcastic also is Danish. And, he doesn't sympathize with Hitler, at all...beautiful...hilarious. That is very funny except the place he was acting very Danish was not proper. He got booted from Caanes. For that, but his pornography and horror films are okay. That is funny. And then what he said about the French. Ouch...the French were very mean to the Jews, during WWII. Got to love the huevos on him.

To be fair, one of the things he actually said was "I'm a Nazi".

 

I think, he said he was more like a Nazi, and he was pissed off at his Mom for tricking him into not know his true father so he would succeed. The fact that it worked, he said if he knew, he would not have made films and he called her a slut. So, if he said " I am a Nazi." I think it was in a Danish (sarcastic) way.

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To be fair, one of the things he actually said was "I'm a Nazi".

 

To be fair you as many other people do not understand in what context he said it. The medias and Rothschild did a good job here twisting the meaning of his words and people do not want to understand what it was he actually said and meant. I am not going to write a huge step by step explanation from that press-conference as it's probably a waste of time to explain people that he is far from being a Nazi or sympathetic with Nazi's but just mark my words that it's totally taken out of context and it was a joke (served badly due to his nature and extremely bad English) - he said it was a joke many times during the press-conference and the reporters also laughed - related to that he for his first 32 years of his life thought his father was Jewish but at his mothers dead-bed he was told the father he knew was not his real father and that his biological father was of German decent. That's where the joke originated from simply because he was very sad he was no longer was of Jewish heritage (he was very proud of his Jewish heritage) and he joked many times to his friends and in public in Denmark that now he was a "Nazi" .And people got the joke ;)

 

He has apologized a million times yet the wolves are on him 24/7. I wonder what interest are served her - Hollywood ;)

 

Point is I find it absolutely double standard and hypocritical that we are not allowed to joke about Nazi's, Jewish people or criticize anything related to Israel (a huge taboo ) whereas it's all fine to mock and joke about all other religions and especially stigmatize Muslims in the west (in the name of "free speech").But the minute a person find something interesting related to Hitler (in his case the architecture and the way the Nazi's went overboard in their own power-trip) and joke with anything related to Hiler then the person is being labeled as a Nazi or antisemitic. Isn't it time to move on :)

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Thank you, Tatsu.(Dragon) As I still would like to debate the subtleties of Twisted and Lone Deranger with you. You always are able to put up with my ramblings with a zen-like patience.

Arigatō.

 

 

Thank you.

...

Feel free to do so! :) I think the debate about psy and goa is interesting, doesn't matter if we agree or not. Depending on the intensity of your ramblings (as you call them ;)) I'm not always sure if I really get what you're saying. But we still manage to talk so it's not a problem I guess. To keep up the subject: I've listened to several tracks of both albums and to me the difference is that Twisted (which is Goa for me) is somehow softer and more melody driven (in a swirling way, not in a cheesy way) while Lone Deranger feels faster and harder, but also in a melodic way.

 

Maybe also a little input about the whole religion thing. I'm absolutey not a fan of any organised religion and I personaly don't believe in god (I still think he could exist, means I'm an agnostic). People who want to lecture me about their religion and about how it is the ultimate truth make me angry. But not all people following a religion or a believe are that way. I do believe that there are people in the scene who practice/follow hinduism (or Buddhism or whatever) not only with hanging some fluorescent pictures on the wall and being all shanti-shanti but with the truth of their heart. If they don't lecture me (talking about it is perfectly fine of course) about it I see nothing wrong with that. The decoration inspired by that (or inspired by the people who only follow it as a trend or whatever) does not bother me. I can see it as a piece of art and if it's nice according to my taste I like it. I mean disliking the use of the symbols is one thing, to each his own. But because of that making the judgement that everybody in the scene just follows the flow and does not honestly believe in that stuff is quite a generalisation that might make some people angry. I can even understand them.

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To be fair you as many other people do not understand in what context he said it. The medias and Rothschild did a good job here twisting the meaning of his words and people do not want to understand what it was he actually said and meant. I am not going to write a huge step by step explanation from that press-conference as it's probably a waste of time to explain people that he is far from being a Nazi or sympathetic with Nazi's but just mark my words that it's totally taken out of context and it was a joke (served badly due to his nature and extremely bad English) - he said it was a joke many times during the press-conference and the reporters also laughed - related to that he for his first 32 years of his life thought his father was Jewish but at his mothers dead-bed he was told the father he knew was not his real father and that his biological father was of German decent. That's where the joke originated from simply because he was very sad he was no longer was of Jewish heritage (he was very proud of his Jewish heritage) and he joked many times to his friends and in public in Denmark that now he was a "Nazi" .And people got the joke ;)

 

He has apologized a million times yet the wolves are on him 24/7. I wonder what interest are served her - Hollywood ;)

 

Point is I find it absolutely double standard and hypocritical that we are not allowed to joke about Nazi's, Jewish people or criticize anything related to Israel (a huge taboo ) whereas it's all fine to mock and joke about all other religions and especially stigmatize Muslims in the west (in the name of "free speech").But the minute a person find something interesting related to Hitler (in his case the architecture and the way the Nazi's went overboard in their own power-trip) and joke with anything related to Hiler then the person is being labeled as a Nazi or antisemitic. Isn't it time to move on :)

 

You know what is more backwards than anything? Is most of the time, the Jews aren't the ones criticizing. It is some bleeding heart gentile that wants to curry favor with Jews and they publicly say what they think another Jew would feel about it. Guess what? Most of the time they don't care. And they feel the same way you do, Elysium. They just want to leave that in the past and move on. Imagine if you were a survivor of the Holocaust, would you want it to be brought up every other day in the news or would you want the whole thing to be forgotten? Of course, the media will answer completely different than the survivor. And the stigmatization o Muslims is also the media. I have not met one Muslim that has treated me more sincerely with kindness and generosity. I have no idea who these people that the news are talking about. You can't learn about other cultures on the news. You can't really learn about another human unless you engage in a personal interaction. Again, these are all methods of fear mongering. A government must keep its people afraid. It is much easier to control a scared person than a confident one. IMO
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Okay, sorry, but when one makes a poll like this, I just am tempted to vote "no" ... which is what I did - because I think that poll is stupid ... why asking others, decide for yourself :P

 

If you wanna hear my opinion:

 

From my admin point of view it's fine when you stay as long as you stick to the rules. Which you didn't always do, but nevermind that...

 

From my personal point of view I don't really know you enough to say anything. You have some manners that are not too desirable - for example the caps. On the other hand you bring life to this place ... make people discuss and stuff. That is good. I don't really have the time to engage in the discussion, but it's a good thing - as long as it stays within boundaries.

I don't really know your personality, but it seems like you're a bit of a gentleman inside a shell. This thread proves it. It's good that you made it and discuss how people see you, that's ok (the poll is still stupid though IMO :D ). To me it seems like the gentleman inside you is occasionally silenced by the intake of various controlled substances though (admit it, you made some posts while drugged). And this is not that good. But if you work on that (and consider the points Abasio mentioned), I see it as a good thing to stay.

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Feel free to do so! :) I think the debate about psy and goa is interesting, doesn't matter if we agree or not. Depending on the intensity of your ramblings (as you call them ;)) I'm not always sure if I really get what you're saying. But we still manage to talk so it's not a problem I guess. To keep up the subject: I've listened to several tracks of both albums and to me the difference is that Twisted (which is Goa for me) is somehow softer and more melody driven (in a swirling way, not in a cheesy way) while Lone Deranger feels faster and harder, but also in a melodic way.

 

Maybe also a little input about the whole religion thing. I'm absolutey not a fan of any organised religion and I personaly don't believe in god (I still think he could exist, means I'm an agnostic). People who want to lecture me about their religion and about how it is the ultimate truth make me angry. But not all people following a religion or a believe are that way. I do believe that there are people in the scene who practice/follow hinduism (or Buddhism or whatever) not only with hanging some fluorescent pictures on the wall and being all shanti-shanti but with the truth of their heart. If they don't lecture me (talking about it is perfectly fine of course) about it I see nothing wrong with that. The decoration inspired by that (or inspired by the people who only follow it as a trend or whatever) does not bother me. I can see it as a piece of art and if it's nice according to my taste I like it. I mean disliking the use of the symbols is one thing, to each his own. But because of that making the judgement that everybody in the scene just follows the flow and does not honestly believe in that stuff is quite a generalisation that might make some people angry. I can even understand them.

 

I have also been listening to the two albums. And I agree with your analysis. I am just not sure if the softness that you speak is what causes a genre change. But, it may very well be. I mean Twisted is like the light-hearted-happy-go-lucky younger brother of the lone deranger. To me, Twisted is very loving and beautiful and kinder representation or the Yin side of Hallucinogen. Where The lone deranger is the darker, wicked, and almost demonic Yang side of Hallucinogen. But you know Yin and Yang can not exist without the other so maybe Goa is the Yin and Psy is the Yang and Goa/Psy Trance is just Yin/Yang Trance. and they can not be apart. It's funny that this symbol was not from Buddhism or Hinduism, but Taoism. Which if someone put a gun to my head and told me I had to associate with one religion or they would pull the trigger. I would easily confess, Taoism(Daoism is the same right?)

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I have also been listening to the two albums. And I agree with your analysis. I am just not sure if the softness that you speak is what causes a genre change. But, it may very well be. I mean Twisted is like the light-hearted-happy-go-lucky younger brother of the lone deranger. To me, Twisted is very loving and beautiful and kinder representation or the Yin side of Hallucinogen. Where The lone deranger is the darker, wicked, and almost demonic Yang side of Hallucinogen. But you know Yin and Yang can not exist without the other so maybe Goa is the Yin and Psy is the Yang and Goa/Psy Trance is just Yin/Yang Trance. and they can not be apart. It's funny that this symbol was not from Buddhism or Hinduism, but Taoism. Which if someone put a gun to my head and told me I had to associate with one religion or they would pull the trigger. I would easily confess, Taoism(Daoism is the same right?)

 

Imho a very, very nice description of the differences between those albums! :wub: And very much the way I feel about them. I mean I love both of those albums and matching them up like ying and yang makes sense to me. To me they do belong together and also the terms goa and psy do since for me they are psychedelic dance music. If because of that goa and psy are the same lies in the eyes of the beholder I think. The distinctino makes sense to me since it helps to find albums for each style and making it easier to describe what I'm looking for. On the other hand since people don't always use the same standarts when talking about goa and psy it can also be confusing.

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How did we get onto Twisted/Lone Deranger? Certainly, I don't mind... two of my favorite albums for sure.

That said, while I like the yin/yang comparisons... Twisted feels pretty "dark" in its own right to me. Dark Magus and Shamanix feel so edgy and... liminal.

 

Taoism is a branch of Buddhism, no?

No... From a phenomenological standpoint, taoism is the esoteric component of 'Chinese traditional religion' and really can't function as a complete entity without the rest of the trappings of traditional chinese religion... but it bears distinct similarities in its form with Mahayana (Northern) Buddhism, and when Mahayana arrived in China, the two began to function as an organic synthesis, similarly to the way in which Mahayana/Vajrayana and Shinto do in Japan. :)

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Taoism is a branch of Buddhism, no ?

 

Taoism (also spelled Daoism) and Buddhism are two separate religions that developed in different parts of the world around the same period of time, with Taoism possible developing a few hundred years earlier.

 

Taoism developed in China while Buddhism developed in India, both close to (this isn't an exact date) 450 BCE.

 

Taoism developed from shamanic traditions with such early works as the I-Ching (much earlier than Taoism), Nei Yeh, Lao-Tzu, and Chuang-Tzu.

 

Buddhism developed from the oral teachings of Siddhartha Gautama (the Buddha).

 

The traditional symbol associated with Taoism is the taijitu (yin-yang symbol), though the symbol and concept is present in many Chinese belief systems and didn't originate from Taoism itself.

 

There are many sects of Buddhism ranging from atheistic and agnostic in a sense to polytheistic.

Taoism can also be seen as a range of sects from atheistic all the way to polytheistic.

 

Just a quick primer, I couldn't resist! :) Taoism and Buddhism are two interests of mine.

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To be fair you as many other people do not understand in what context he said it.

 

Oh, I understood it all right. I just found the man's apparent lack of media savvy funny.

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