Who's the Brain behind these groups?

[Goa Bill]

There is ALMOST ALWAYS a driving force behind collaborations. I think that is what Ormion meant.

Disagree. As for Infected Mushroom's example, Izen made some uber cheesy tracks on his own and Duvdev's Now is the time is the stuff from which cheese legends are being made. Together though they made great tracks as well.

Since Ian Ion's departure from Kox Box all the recent tracks were made by Frank'e in collaborations. With Dada, Tube, Xavier and more (his recent album). It's still a great album but Ian Ion's departure is well felt. Ian Ion's solo tracks are not that great as well I think.

[Anoebis]

There is ALMOST ALWAYS a driving force behind collaborations. I think that is what Ormion meant.

true, altough I know some terrible examples of groups with 2 members... Where 1 is producing music and the second is just the "manager" and showball on live acts *cough cough*

[NEMO.BOFH]

Disagree. As for Infected Mushroom's example, Izen made some uber cheesy tracks on his own and Duvdev's Now is the time is the stuff from which cheese legends are being made. Together though they made great tracks as well.

Since Ian Ion's departure from Kox Box all the recent tracks were made by Frank'e in collaborations. With Dada, Tube, Xavier and more (his recent album). It's still a great album but Ian Ion's departure is well felt. Ian Ion's solo tracks are not that great as well I think.

You disagree in some cases you mean? It depends from case to case, like I said in a previous post, X-Dream is a 50/50 thing. And lets not forget about for instance Sven Vath, where the REAL BRAIN was Ralf Hildenbeutel. Sven has good ideas, that is all. Lets not get into The Orb, Dr. Alex P. has the ideas, but knows jack shit about studio and producing in a high end studio and is dependent on people to help him (Fact taken from Sound on Sound interview with him). I think without Youth, there would be no The Orb. Just a few examples, and there are many many more.

 

One that I really can not put my fingers on is Eat Static, but I guess we will see when the next uptempo album comes which is only done by Mr Merv himself

[Malevol3nt]

Radiculous topic. It's like asking whom of your parents was the "brain".

It's a creation and even Raja Ram had an enormous part of Shpongle without even touching a synth. If you'd ever create music with another person you'd understand.

+302

+302

[Ormion]

Disagree. As for Infected Mushroom's example, Izen made some uber cheesy tracks on his own and Duvdev's Now is the time is the stuff from which cheese legends are being made. Together though they made great tracks as well.

Since Ian Ion's departure from Kox Box all the recent tracks were made by Frank'e in collaborations. With Dada, Tube, Xavier and more (his recent album). It's still a great album but Ian Ion's departure is well felt. Ian Ion's solo tracks are not that great as well I think.

 

Prodigy anyone?

And please I don't to hear anyone said that Keith, Maxim or Lerroy are as important as Liam. Yes, Prodigy wouldn't be the same without their vocals/dancing/live acts and yes, they even helped in writting in some tracks, but Liam was always the Brain behind Prodigy.

 

 

 

Please guys don't try to mutate this topic into something that is not.

 

Screenwriter, producer, actors, director of photography etc, are all important in the making of a movie, but the Brain is the director.

 

edit: It's like comic drawings.

There's the artist who draws, the artist who does the inking and the artist who does the coloring. They are all importants, but the illustrator is the heart of the comic

[HolyLight]

Prodigy anyone?

And please I don't to hear anyone said that Keith, Maxim or Lerroy are as important as Liam. Yes, Prodigy wouldn't be the same without their vocals/dancing/live acts and yes, they even helped in writting in some tracks, but Liam was always the Brain behind Prodigy.

 

 

 

Please guys don't try to mutate this topic into something that is not.

 

Screenwriter, producer, actors, director of photography etc, are all important in the making of a movie, but the Brain is the director.

 

edit: It's like comic drawings.

There's the artist who draws, the artist who does the inking and the artist who does the coloring. They are all importants, but the illustrator is the heart of the comic

 

 

+1

 

 

and btw talking about Erez Izen and cheese.. i can not forget the worst cheese he made, when he had a collaboration with DJ Jörg.. lol when two cheese maestros come together...dangerous

[reger]

CBL ?

both i assume, but why dont you ask them?

 

 

Radiculous topic. It's like asking whom of your parents was the "brain".

It's a creation and even Raja Ram had an enormous part of Shpongle without even touching a synth. If you'd ever create music with another person you'd understand.

uh, oh

[HolyLight]

In this old interview with Erez Eizen he says when asked by the interviewer:

 

How much did you really worked together? Was there really a thing called Shidapu? I saw a lot of tracks, that each has some of you credited for it.

 

 

"There was not really Shidapu. For example, there was a track that Ido Ophir made (Stay Strong), Miki remixed it, and actually it's Ido's track mainly, that Miki worked on a bit, but it appears as Shidapu's with all our names on it. The truth is that it was quite a stupid thing to do, I still feel bad about it today.

It worked like that- one or two of us made a track and everybody's names were on it. Oren quit the group Six months after we got released on Phonokol and left music. It was basically Roy, Miki and myself then. Me and Roy got into a bit of fighting, 16 years old kids, and then there was a situation were Miki and me are making stuff as Shidapu and also Miki and Roy are making other stuff as Shidapu. We continued like that and I made a lot of tracks by myself, three days for each track. And then I met Jorg."

 

 

Source: http://www.isratrance.com/ViewInterview.ph...=6&lang=eng

[RTP]

There is ALMOST ALWAYS a driving force behind collaborations. I think that is what Ormion meant.

That's not good then though ... I think.

Groups of artists should make music together, not one having the ideas and the other playing just a side role. Not even slightly. What would the other people be here for then? They must be equally important and put work into the project at the same degree. Otherwise the others are like "session musicans" in bands and that's quite a low level of existence...

[abasio]

How about The Kumba Mela Experiment?

 

Quite a melting pot of talent there but they blended very well

[draeke]

true, altough I know some terrible examples of groups with 2 members... Where 1 is producing music and the second is just the "manager" and showball on live acts *cough cough*

+604

 

SOoooooo True there are various groups that are managed by one member and the music is fully made by the other dude.. but hey all is ok when the result is good

[NEMO.BOFH]

That's not good then though ... I think.

Groups of artists should make music together, not one having the ideas and the other playing just a side role. Not even slightly. What would the other people be here for then? They must be equally important and put work into the project at the same degree. Otherwise the others are like "session musicans" in bands and that's quite a low level of existence...

Why? If the artists can work together in a way that both of them are doing something and no one is ripping the other off, I think its a fair deal that one has all the ideas, while the other is maybe "Just managing the group" or "Being the technical brain" or "Just plays the flute and has shpongly ideas". Maybe it was wrong of me to suggest the word Brain, maybe I should have suggested "The Driving force"

[U.F.Orb]

That's not good then though ... I think.

Groups of artists should make music together, not one having the ideas and the other playing just a side role. Not even slightly. What would the other people be here for then? They must be equally important and put work into the project at the same degree. Otherwise the others are like "session musicans" in bands and that's quite a low level of existence...

I Agree.

music and ideas should come from both brains 50-50,there is no point if one of them isnt making

the music and all he do is taking care of live acts and bookings,it's silly IMO.

[NEMO.BOFH]

I Agree.

music and ideas should come from both brains 50-50,there is no point if one of them isnt making

the music and all he do is taking care of live acts and bookings,it's silly IMO.

You are talking of it like a duo that works like that are not agreeing on being setup like that, like the "managing" part is some kind of nazi with a whip that the other can not get rid of... damn you are funny.

[HolyLight]

I Agree.

music and ideas should come from both brains 50-50,there is no point if one of them isnt making

the music and all he do is taking care of live acts and bookings,it's silly IMO.

 

Well it doesn't matter what you/me or anyone else thinks really, its a fact thats how it is in a lot of psy groups and yes i agree its silly but hey.. its psy music. not much in this scene that makes sense.. fake live acts.. fake artists who doesnt even make their own music (dali, psynina etc) scammers and what not..

[U.F.Orb]

You are talking of it like a duo that works like that are not agreeing on being setup like that, like the "managing" part is some kind of nazi with a whip that the other can not get rid of... damn you are funny.

Happy you find my words amusing nemo

i didnt mean my words to sound like you understand them,with the nazi part and all,i just think

the way they both agree with this was,like "ok listen up,i do the music,you get us some gigs,chick's

and keep the money on our way and we both get the credit,were a team!"

that's silly (IMO)

to tell you the truth this is the first time i hear such a thing about grups,ive been living in my own world perhaps.

 

Well it doesn't matter what you/me or anyone else thinks really, its a fact thats how it is in a lot of psy groups and yes i agree its silly but hey.. its psy music. not much in this scene that makes sense.. fake live acts.. fake artists who doesnt even make their own music (dali, psynina etc) scammers and what not..

hehe:)

i guess that's what artist or fakers with shitty music make (dail,psynina etc).

a pitty but i couldnt care less about those artist or that kinda style of music (no offens to all dali,psynina fans out there)

and in a look from above the psytrance scean all i have to say is where did we all go wrong,how the hell

did the psytrance scean got so damn popy superstar attitude take control...

man the 90's were the best time EVER for me,not just with the music itself,it had a special vibe,2000's a bitch!

 

*sorry for my english guy's,so much to say but it's realy hard for me to express myslef in english.

[RTP]

Why? If the artists can work together in a way that both of them are doing something and no one is ripping the other off, I think its a fair deal that one has all the ideas, while the other is maybe "Just managing the group" or "Being the technical brain" or "Just plays the flute and has shpongly ideas". Maybe it was wrong of me to suggest the word Brain, maybe I should have suggested "The Driving force"

The deal might be fair, but it's just not how it should be in a group. If one of them has all the ideas, then he's the artist and not the group. The other guy is something like a "session musician" or a hired manager or whatever, but IMO he doesn't deserve the credit that an artist has.

What I imagine to be a collaboration is that all of the artists involved contribute with their own ideas, thus forming the bits and pieces of inputs together to an artwork. You know, like it's the case when you're talking with a really good friend - you both enrich each other vice versa and the sum of the parts is greater than all the parts together taken alone ... know what I mean? That's what the image of a collaboration, a group, a duo or whatever is for me in music. Most of the time when two solo-artists decide to do a project together you also can hear elements from both of them enriching each other ... at least that's the case in god collabs. And then you actually can hear that they had fun working together

And when it's not like that it's not a good sign IMO ... it's not a real collaboration ... it's one guys having all the ideas - "being the actual project" and the other one just a session musican, not worth more than a piece of gear so to say. If the other dude(s) were not there the music would sound the same. And if that's the case, then I think it's kinda sad...

 

Well it doesn't matter what you/me or anyone else thinks really, its a fact thats how it is in a lot of psy groups and yes i agree its silly but hey.. its psy music. not much in this scene that makes sense.. fake live acts.. fake artists who doesnt even make their own music (dali, psynina etc) scammers and what not..

I, however, an not into scammers. And I don't think anybody on here actually is. Except Pavel maybe and his obsession with the Chemical Crew every now and then...

[NEMO.BOFH]

Hillarious!

[Drosophila]

I mean Koxbox nowadays are Frank E and a young guy, right? Apparenlty in some point Ian left the group too?

I don't know if they officuially split up (don't think so!), but as I understand it the way works out is that Frank'e is doing the koxbox stuff (live ect.) and Ion is doing the Saiko Pod stuff (live ect.), but as seen on u-turn they are not not working together... but they are kind of seperated

 

Radiculous topic. It's like asking whom of your parents was the "brain".

It's a creation and even Raja Ram had an enormous part of Shpongle without even touching a synth. If you'd ever create music with another person you'd understand.

Haha u got a point, I have been making some music w a friend, and sure ideas are emensly important, but they go no where with-out the skills to make them reality

[NEMO.BOFH]

One could argue that your point of view is right out of an artistic aspect, however if you take a look at a "real" group such as Depeche Mode, you will find one suicidal singer (Dave), one songwriter (Martin) and one manager (Andy). That is their setup/concept, and they would not be who they are today if all those components weren't there.

Hoooray!

[RTP]

Hillarious!

what's so funny?

 

One could argue that your point of view is right out of an artistic aspect, however if you take a look at a "real" group such as Depeche Mode, you will find one suicidal singer (Dave), one songwriter (Martin) and one manager (Andy). That is their setup/concept, and they would not be who they are today if all those components weren't there.

Well, yes, this is true.

But as people always argue, "electronic music is produced differently" ... well, yes. Electronic music is produced differently! Time to drop this band thing where everybody does something else and time to make everybody involved on a same level, on the same things!