The good and bad of a big scene

[Guest bugbread]

The good:

 

Lots of great artists and parties.

 

The bad:

 

Because of the burgeoning scene here, psychedelic drugs have gotten a lot more attention and users. The result: mushrooms are illegal starting next month. Crap.

 

-me

Don't wanna get deported, so I guess it's booze from here on out.

[Guest sudh1r]

and more unwanted people go to the parties

[Guest Elysium Project]

Unwanted people? - I did not know that there was an elite of goa trancers and unwanted people!

 

What a weird attitude!

[Guest Navigator]

unwanted people ??? you are a pathetic example of a human being sudh1r!

[Guest preus]

i think he is refering to people like bikers, and the crowd that fills them selves with cocain and steroids, (i hope)

[Guest bugbread]

I didn't think there were "unwanted people" until they started coming to the parties. Guys who are looking for fights, chicks who spend a day in the restrooms adjusting their makeup or doing C, making my girlfriend wait hours just to take a pee. People who can't handle their stuff and are puking or being assholes. People who scream constantly because they're tripping so hard. People who steal stuff. People who push other people out of their way.

 

We didn't have any of that crap until psy became popular.

 

Psy should be an exclusive scene, but not in the sense of "exclusive to goa heads". It should be exclusive to good people. I could care less if the people around me are wearing fluoro, tie-dye, raver pants, or business suits, but I'd be happy to go back to the days when goa parties were unique for people being nice to eachother, picking up their trash, and dancing in harmony.

[Guest Mijis]

The good : all the good vibes and the people united for the music

The bad : The "chacales" or "nacos" (people that dont pay for their ticket and want to enter free to the party using the force of a hundred more nacos just to steal things or get high and doesn`t care for the music) They are like parasites .

[Guest StoNeY!]

I understand your point bugbread. This weekend I had a pretty shocking experience too at a psy party. It was a free party, no flyer needed etc...

There were some locals hanging around at the party and at first it didn't look like they were doing something wrong, but then I noticed they started makin' stupid remarks to people. So after a while we bumped in to a fight at the dancefloor entrance, it was all dark and I couldn't really see what was going on.

I was pretty shocked seeing this at a psy party, never saw violence before at a psy event, but maybe I was too naive believing this sort of thing would never happen.

So, in a way, there are "unwanted people", but it's impossible to draw that line I think.

For me, if you come for the music and you don't harasse or bother people you're "wanted".

[bomble]

Perhaps it would have been better put 'unwanted behaviour'. The scene does need to keep it's integrity whilst being accessible to anyone who enjoys the music. I don't mean the music needs to be more accessible - but I think the parties could be. How many parties are done in venues with disabled access. Somehow Greg Sams manages to get to most places (as anyone who is familiar with him will have noticed) - but he's a bit exceptional.

 

Of course I don't like to see the kind of behaviour some of you describe, but I wouldn't want to turn anyone who was enjoying the party away.

 

bomble

[Guest Mike D]

Man, this sounds like a group of Right Wing Elitests! No other people, keep it to the chosen few! Damn, if you don't like the way some dude or girl is behving, go over the otherside of the roo. I think it is great that the osy scene is welcoming here in Melbourne. You need to change your attitude, I mean, seriously, it is that kind of an attitude that has turned many of my friends who love my cd's away from the scene. They basically all say that goaheads are just real wankers who think they are sooo cool for listening ot "tripper" music. Psy has got a real bad name witin the entire electroninc music scene because of this attitude, the "We are special" attitude, grow up guys, and accept that life is full of wankers! Just take a look of this forum :-)

[Guest JanUa]

good ... the satisfaction that all these nice people get from this lifestyle

 

bad ... unwanted behaviour

 

i'm looking .... i found one ;-)

[Guest Maak ku paax]

Damn mijis! You made me laugh!

[Strumpling]

you better STOCK UP on shrooms dude

[Guest ironmonkey]

Put the mirror down Mike.

[Guest bugbread]

Mike, mike, mike...Please read ALL the words in the posts before you respond to them.

 

"No other people, keep it to the chosen few!"

 

For me, the "chosen few" is like 95% of the population. I'm happy with pretty much anyone coming to the show. I like it when super non-goa-heads come. I'd just prefer that yakuza and hoodlums and assholes not come. I wasn't aware that disliking people who cause suffering was "right wing elitism".

 

"Damn, if you don't like the way some dude or girl is behving, go over the otherside of the roo."

 

Ok, I can understand why you said this, but you haven't seen the party scene here. The other side of the room is just as bad! There is nowhere to run. There have always been troublemakers before, but they were isolated. Now the only "solution" is to leave the party.

 

"I mean, seriously, it is that kind of an attitude that has turned many of my friends who love my cd's away from the scene."

 

Your friends have been turned away from the scene because people in the scene have said "I wish people would throw away their garbage and not pick fights"? What kind of friends do you have that would prefer littering and fighting?

 

"Psy has got a real bad name witin the entire electroninc music scene because of this attitude, the "We are special" attitude"

 

Well, yes and no. It has that image in the scene in other countries, and that's A Bad Thing. It doesn't have that image in Japan, but instead has a really bad party vibe and government crackdowns. Which is worse? I don't know for sure, but I can ignore bad attitude on a forum by people who think they're elite. I CAN'T ignore being busted for shroom posession or getting a fight picked because I stepped on some gangster's foot when dancing.

 

Yes, elitism is bad, but I'm just saying that assholes shouldn't come to parties. You can be a Britney Spears fan, you can play Everquest all day, you can love Richie Hawtin, I don't care. Just don't cause suffering to those around you. Is that really "evil right-wing elitism"?

 

Besides which, I'm missing the point of my own post. All I wanted to do was point out to those people who live in places with really small psy scenes that big scenes are not all wine and roses, there are also thorns.

[Guest russ]

bugbread,

I have to say that I find EP and Mike's stance a little self-righteous, and a little predictable. Whenever I see someone mention the fact the crowds have changed for the worse, you can always count on someone to attack them and pull the "holier than thou", everybody's welcome, and if you don't think so you're a fluoro fascist stuck-up hippy. but that's obviously an absurd position. broadly speaking, people who respect what is going on (whatever that might be) are welcome, and people who have no respect for what is going on are not. it is as simple as that. it has absolutely nothing to do with style or age or clothes or musical taste or background or coolness or elitism or the way you dance or anything else. it is simply a matter of respect. of course somebody could then counter, "everybody has the right to determine what is going on", but this position is equally absurd. there is behavior that doesn't affect anyone else, and any such behavior should be welcome at a party, whether it be dancing the lambada to x-dream or doing cartwheels to KoxBox. if it doesn't hurt other people, it's cool. and then there is behahior which directly inhibits other peole's enjoyment of the party. such behavior includes:

1) banging on drums and blowing whistles 2) sexually harassing girls 3) intentionally frightening others 4) beating the @!#$ out of someone on the dancefloor

i too am in japan, so i know exactly what bugbread is referring to. my girlfriend has to put up with all kinds of male bullshit at the parties these days, a task made harder when she is tripping. all she wants to do is go outdoors and dance with a bit of Sid without some @!#$ grabbing her ass or squeezing her chest from behind. Mike D and EP, is this @!#$ welcome to your parties? last summer, i was lucky enough to witness, on acid, some poor @!#$ getting his head bludgeoned with a wrench, and then while he was lying motionless on the ground, getting pounded mercilessly by a group of punk mafia wannabe's. and then we were all blessed with the never-before-seen sight of an ambulance arriving to carry this guy off on a stretcher. all of this, mind you, on the middle of the dancefloor in front of the stage, in a beautiful location with a view of Mt Fuji. Mike D and EP, do you welcome ambulances at your parties? Is this @!#$ who keeps a wrench in his tent to bludgeon heads welcome at your parties? Think about it and get back to me.

this behavior is the direct result of MASSIVE promotion by the organizers, and the MASSIVE amounts on money and hard drugs involved in the scene. it is not a pretty sight when it goes bad. there are still awesome parties out there, but i am afraid the "unwelcome" will eventually find those too, and when that happens, i will stop making parties here and move to taiwan or somewhere else and try to start again with a more naive and innocent and less jaded and nasty crowd.

[Guest Elysium Project]

So now I am self-righteous?

 

What's next???

 

Just because I believe that all people are welcome to join a party does that make me self-righteous?

 

I never said that I agree with people that disturb the party!

 

All I said was that I found sudh1r's comment weird and yes indeed a very eliteish way of thinking!

 

If that make me predictable and self-righteous then I am proud to be that!

[Guest Elysium Project]

I am sure that you russ (no offense) would get very angry and feel left outside if someone tell you that you're a wrong type of person and not welcome in the party/club because you have dread's or fluro clothes ect. (Which I of course dont know if you have :-))

I am sure that it also happens many places but that does not make it more right!

 

At least our scene is supposed to be more openminded and accept people no matter who and what they are! - If a biker, a office suit, a transwestite, gay and lesbians, black and white, asian's and religious different thinking people are behaving ok and none violent then why shouldn't he or she or they not be allowed to join the party?

 

That was my point! - hopefully many other people agree with me - if not then this scene has lost it's orginality and purpose.

[Guest ironmonkey]

sudh1r used the nebulous term "unwanted people". Some of you attached your own notions of what that meant. Instead of seeking clarification you assumed your interpretation of his statement was his manifesto then got all PC about it.

 

I am sure that sudh1r meant what russ mentioned. People that show up and ruin everyone elses time through assault and harrassment.

 

Its not elitist to want to be able to go somewhere and not feel like prey, especially a party. That's the antithesis of a party. Some of you people need to seriously lighten up.

[Guest JanUa]

yeah EP thats your point ... i agree ...but if "we" have to be openminded than let the new kids be openminded too, if they arn't ... please go home and let us keep on having the fun we had ... leave f*cked up attitudes at home ...

 

but now read again Russ his post and try to answer to his opinion and his experience ... try to be openminded to that ... you only try to defend yourself while no harm was done.

 

and btw

as long as one person keeps loving this music and the happy lifestyle, this scene will never loose it's originality and purpose ... try to stand in my way

 

... JanUa .... . . . ..... . . .... . ...3ô... . . . . . . . . . .

*openminded*

[Guest bugbread]

Ironmonkey, you rock!

 

Sudh1r said "and more unwanted people go to the parties". I interpreted that to be "more assholes", EP apparently interpreted that to mean people other than "elite of goa trancers". Heck, somebody even called Sudh1r a "pathetic example of a human being". Seems like a better thing to do than trying to rip Sudh1r a new asshole is ask him/her, "what do you mean by 'unwanted people'?".

 

As far as I'm concerned, this thread has contained the following people and basic stances:

 

Bugbread: Dislikes troublemakers. Welcomes others.

Sudh1r: Probably dislikes troublemakers. Probably welcomes others.

Elysium Project: Probably dislikes troublemakers. Welcomes others.

Navigator: Probably dislikes troublemakers. Welcomes others.

Preus: Dislikes troublemakers. Welcomes others.

Mijis: Dislikes troublemakers. Welcomes others.

Stoney: Dislikes troublemakers. Welcomes others.

Bomble: Dislikes troublemakers. Welcomes others.

Mike D: Likes troublemakers. Welcomes others.

Janua: Dislikes troublemakers. Welcomes others.

Maak ku paax: Likes laughing. The rest unclear.

Strumpling: Likes shrooms. The rest unclear.

Ironmonkey: Dislikes troublemakers. Welcomes others.

Russ: Dislikes troublemakers. Welcomes others.

 

So I can't see why everyone is getting so upset at eachother.

 

And, yes, EP, as you said: "All I said was that I found sudh1r's comment weird and yes indeed a very eliteish way of thinking! If that make me predictable and self-righteous then I am proud to be that!"

I think assuming that nebulous comments by other people must mean bad things and must therefore be immediately and severely corrected is what makes you considered "self-righteous" by many people in the forums.

[Guest russ]

EP,

 

i am sorry to have upset you and i didn't mean to offend, but you seemed to have missed my point.

 

you said:

At least our scene is supposed to be more openminded and accept people no matter who and what they are! - If a biker, a office suit, a transwestite, gay and lesbians, black and white, asian's and religious different thinking people are behaving ok and none violent then why shouldn't he or she or they not be allowed to join the party?

 

and of course i am 100% in agreement with that, as is everyone here i imagine. that is exactly what i meant when i said "dancing the lambada to x-dream or doing cartwheels to koxbox". i want to see as many different people of as many different colors in as many different clothes dancing in as many different ways as the body allows. to me there is little psychedelic about flouro. but watching an old dude in a suit dancing at a party, now that is truely psychedelic. i really dislike the cliquish nature of the cooler-than-thou hippy travelling scene when it descends into fluoro fascism. but that wasn't i was talking about.

 

please read my post again, and you'll see the ONLY thing i care about is people respecting other people. in other words, not grabbing girls and not hitting people in the head with wrenches.

 

i think the misunderstanding arose from our two different situations. as a veteran artist, you have probably been exposed to much self-righteous bullshit and elitism (and it is there to be sure) from the trance scene. but i was writing thinking about two incidents in Japan this summer: one in which someone got severly beaten and bloodied with a baseball bat at a beach party, and the one i mentioned above about someone getting bludgeoned in the head with a metal wrench.

 

so by "unwelcome" i merely mean (as do we all, as bugbread nicely pointed out above): sexual perverts and wrench-wielding, bat-swinging mafia.

 

so in the end, i am sure we both agree with each other, even if we took a roundabout way to get there. and no need to get upset if i called you self-righteous. i am self-righteous all the time! it's both a strength and a weakness of a mine. so anyone out there, please feel free to slap me around a bit when i get too preachy:) a reminder never hurts!

 

peace out

[Guest Elysium Project]

I am sorry but I must laugh out very loud now... I am not at all upset or trying to defend myself :-)

 

I really feel that many of you good people are jumping to conclusions about me being angry ect. - maybe you also should take the time to actuallly try to understand where I come from before you start to attack me !

 

I was never angry all I did was trying to explain myself!

 

And to russ - you have nothing to excuse about to me - you did not upset me at all :-) - and yes we doo agree 100% :-))

 

To bugbread - I respect your opinion about me but please dont assume that your opnion is the same as everyone's else.

 

And yes maybe sudh1r indeed was only thinking about people that cause trouble - but that's quite hard to read between the lines when he dosen't make that clear !

 

Did I make myself clear enough?

[Guest bugbread]

Elysium Project:

 

Using exclamation parts frequently makes you seem angry !!

Isn't that obvious???

So does using multiple question marks! !

 

Personally, I almost always get the impression that you're angry, but I have to remind myself "No, EP just likes dramatic expressions and exclamation marks". But although I don't assume everyone agrees with me, I DO suspect that more than a few people on this forum feel that way.

[Guest Elysium Project]

Well in Denmark using exclamation parts just mean that you are making a statement, a comment or a observation - it does not mean that you are angry :-)) And as far as I know it's the same in UK. I don't know about USA but I assume that it's different there?

 

And no in my opinion it's not at all obvious what you say.

 

Using multiple ??? does not at all seem angry to me. To me it's just a way to express myself.

 

I guess there are big differences in interpretation of language from continent to continent ! (a observation - not me being angry).

 

It does seem to me that you overeanalyse everything I write and that you in lack of a better argument try to blaim my writing instead of actually asking me if I am angry or not! - did you not just tell me that I need to ask sudh1r what he actually meant before I assumed anything? - well that is indeed a good idea which I will try to remember - I just hope you will to before you assume things about people ! (again not an angry exclamation part).