Guest DePress Posted October 29, 2002 Share Posted October 29, 2002 Yo dudes. I'm sitting here trying to do some psy tracks using Reason and Cubase SX. But I just can't seem to get the build-up and the drums right... I have listened to psytrance from it's very beginning - but I have painfully found out that producing it is quite different from listening to it and getting tranced with it. :-) And my awe towards my favourite psy-bands (IM, AP, JR, Sphongle, etc.etc.) have become even greater... how the hell do they manage to build the trance so f***ing great??? :-) Do any of you have any references to music theory on psytrance? I just wanna make sure I'm not missing the basic here... (beats, build up, basic instruments used, etc.) Thanks in advance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knasig Frekvens Posted October 29, 2002 Share Posted October 29, 2002 just folow your mind... dont try so mutch.. just play around... have fun.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Reconstructed Posted October 29, 2002 Share Posted October 29, 2002 Psytrance follows many of the same "guidelines" classical or any type of music follow. Learning piano will help you out a lot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest reece Posted October 30, 2002 Share Posted October 30, 2002 if u have no musical theory background, id really advise you to re-asses your desire to write music. psy isnt just 'sounds + technology', u still need a good grasp of what 'makes music, music'! hehehe, but on the other hand, just keep at it, dont give up, and always have fun! :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest fs Posted October 30, 2002 Share Posted October 30, 2002 how long you been at it for? do you have cubase knowledge? if not: Then i would ditch cubase for a while and get used to the basics in reason first.. Can make some pretty shit hot psy tunes with it. After a year and half or 2 of producing music everything seems to fall in to place and you have a better understanding off it all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest coriolis Posted October 31, 2002 Share Posted October 31, 2002 you're going to have to face a few things: -producing great music takes years and years of practice, and you're not going to like your work, maybe not even down the road when you're doing really great, pro stuff. so just make tracks. thats the only rule. make tracks. it doesn't matter they aren't good. just keep making them. -trying to follow rules will only result in your music sounding canned, you'll just be producing run-around tracks that already sound like so many things out there but without any flavor or originality. the best psy producers are the ones who do it like nobody else, which means inherently not following any rules. there are "conventions" of psy trance, like any genre, but the best stuff is the stuff that pays little or no attention to them. the only thing you need to worry about is rockin' the dance floor. -tonal theory will help you to do SOME things in trance, like make backing chords and melodic lines and progressions. however, psy-trance and electronic music in general is much more about sonic texture and rhythmic energy, and less about NOTES. there isn't any theory for that, you just gotta use your own ears and musical sense as a guide, and this sense will develop over time i guarantee it, but only if you're actually doing the work and producing tracks. -buy a pair of quality studio monitors. do not overlook this issue. i know too many people who have overlooked it, including myself, and end up asking themselves "why doesn't it sound right?" you can't get it to sound right without them. coriolis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cricket Posted November 1, 2002 Share Posted November 1, 2002 i was told from a music theory nerd that alot of the "full on" older goa sound is based on two exotic scales that are rarely used in the west. one is called "phrygian" and "locrian", im not an expert so i may be wrong but good luck if you try it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bahamut Posted November 1, 2002 Share Posted November 1, 2002 The melodies in goatrance are usually 'dramatic' sounding. Creating dramatic melodies is easier than making happy melodies, believe it or not. I don't think you need knowledge of music theory to create an average psy-ish melody. However a bit of musical feeling and the ability to play keyboard could be useful I'm not saying there's nothing to it, but what I believe is far more difficult: - the structure of the track (buildup) - getting the right sounds that fit together - production quality, mastering Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest random Posted November 4, 2002 Share Posted November 4, 2002 @ Cricket: Actually, without giving fluffy names to it, lot of older goa use the arabic scale.... C-C#-E-F-G-G#-A#-C... Basically anything played on those notes will sound goa-ish... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Amit_t Posted November 7, 2002 Share Posted November 7, 2002 thanx all after reading these posts i m going right bac to my music making ......... it was getting kind of frustrating on this third trak i m making.......... and thanx to re assert my belief that there are no rules , just follow your heart trance....... the future of music and the music of future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest themessenger Posted November 10, 2002 Share Posted November 10, 2002 well u should not worry i am actualy on my 5 years since im making techno in general and since 2 years it turn listenable like it can play in party but still not so professional it juste start to sound right but by those years i made lots of crap but u should not worry you know i think people who get succcses work for it and its sure that have minimal muasic theorie is not bad but by all this shit you have to find the way you whant to create find the good software you like dont folow whats people are using and dont freak out like lots of people that feelthat by getting 2 virus a 24 iputconsole 4 compressor 4 nordlead and a dual p2.8 will make ur music better hehehe well most of musician got lots of equipement but most of that stuff are useless its only a show and just buy what u realyyyyyyyyyy need cia! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest krime Posted November 12, 2002 Share Posted November 12, 2002 this is a great post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest doublehelix Posted November 17, 2002 Share Posted November 17, 2002 im actually waiting for someone to more specificaly answer crickets question, it sounds intriguing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anthony Clark Posted December 6, 2002 Share Posted December 6, 2002 I going through the same quest for trance style form. Here is an abridged list of sources that I have found, sorted by category. Much of this has been found through exhaustive--to me anyway--internet searches. I suggest you do the same as I have found bits and pieces all over (which I need to compile). There is no Holy Grail that will be handed to you (I am not trying to be abrasive, just voicing my own frustrations ). Keep in mind there are close stylistic relationships between psy trance and goa trance. Some sources claim that Goa Trance, originally called Trance Dance by its proponents, is the 'original' Trance music. Confusion on this issue is not helped by the fact that it was an international style from the start with centers cropping up simultaeously in Germany, Israel, and the Indian province of Goa. Thus the name Goa Trance is misleading. One of the early proponents, Goa Gil, is from San Francisco and has strong ties there. Any stylistic relationships and influences mentioned in the sources below give you idea of what other styles you can research in your quest. Internet sources: Subject-Goa trance history, philosophy, psychedelic elements, and music theory. Plenty of meat compared to most internet sources. www.princeton.edu/~cspock/Goa_Trance.htm Subject-Goa trance history and stylistic influences in interviews. www.goagil.com Subject-Genre guide with entries for Goa Trance, Trance, and Hard Trance. Mainly history with some clues about stylistic elements and music theory. http://www.raw42.com/cgi-bin/genre_guide.p....pl?refer=raw42 Subject-Trance music history and stylistic influences. www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trance_music Subject-Music scales. For Goa trance take note of Major, Minor, Indian-ish, Phrygian, Locrian, various Indian and Hindu, and Persian. http://tyala.freeyellow.com/t4scales.htm Subject-Source for MIDI files. I plan on buying Modular Madness and Programmer's Toolkit. http://www.keyfax.com Subject-(Trivia). Futurism, futurism and music. It may seem of the subject but many ideals for Futurist music are being realized in electronic music. Do you remember a group called "The Art of Noise"--the name is drawn from the title of an article written by Futurist Luigi Russolo. Books: Quick Guide to Dance Music by Ian Waugh A 66 page book with basic information. However, I did pick up a few tricks from it. It has chapters on style definition (and style relationships), pattern sequencing (with some patterns), and a short chapter on effects. Various tips and tidbits are sprinkled throughout in shaded boxes on the sides of the pages. The Techno Primer by Tony Verderosa 96 pages with CD. Just ordered it and so I cannot recommend it one way or another. Electronic Dance Music Programming Secrets (2nd Edition) by Martin Griese and Roger Brown 370 pages with CD. Just ordered it and so I cannot recommend it one way or another. I had to order it from an online store in England. Music, The Brain, and Ecstasy by Robert Jourdain 377 pages. I only mention this as reading it is helping my understanding of both music theory and mixing engineering. Much of the information may seem trivial to others. It discusses the ear, how we hear as well as how brain processes sound, categorizes sound, and is influenced by sound. Chapters on melody, harmony, rhythm, and composition. Sample CD: Modular Sampler: Psychedelic Trance & Goa 2 CD set--one audio, one data. Contains samples, performances (loops), and MIDI files. Good documentation. MIDI files for drums, bass and synth lines. One of four Modular Sampler packages. Ordered it from . To further my goals, I am teaching myself about music theory and mixing engineering. Music theory is giving me a better grasp of what my new hobby is all about. Learn all the rules you can as well as the reasons behind them. Its hard to be innovative and break the rules when you don't know what they are and why they are. For example, the steady beat of the kick drum may seem boring but deviate from it to much and you will screw up the dancers rhythm. Dance music needs some amount of repetition to accomplish its goals. Mixing engineering deals with frequency equalization, panning, and effects as well as some elements of arranging (the compositional structure of a piece). Even a basic idea of mixing theory will help. Psy trance and Goa Trance are both heavy on layering and effects. Best of luck, Anthony Clark P.S.: It all started with that damn Acid Pro 2.0 demo that came with by CD burner a year and a half ago--it seemed so simple back then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.