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the goa constrictor

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3 hours ago, RTP said:

So I coughed up blood last night ... about a mouth full. Never had this before in my life. I was scared to death and panicked, called the Covid-19 hotline ... there they told me to calm down, coughing blood is no symptom (only 5% of Covid patients cough blood) ... test was denied, reason: I have not travelled to a risk zone (Italy or China or Tyrol) in the last 2 weeks.

I have already been through some pretty bad ass lung problems years ago and never coughed up blood - so I suspect there is definitely something wrong with me here.

I called up my doctor and he told me I am now a suspected case of Covid-19 because of the fact that I am practically feeling a little bit weak in the last weeks and now cough blood, but he says at the same time that he can't come over and do a check up because he has no protective equipment. In fact, not many medical units have the equipment, so I am specifically instructed to call ambulance and refer that I am suspected Covid-19 if my condition worsens ... then the people dressed in white overalls come...

The borderline absurd: Covid-19 test can't be done ... I'd have to pay for it myself. I'd almost be tempted to do so, but I may not leave the house now and can't go to the lab that makes the test...

I have no governmental order to stay in quarantine yet - but I am not leaving the house, risk is way too high. Plus I feel weak too...

Stay safe people ... I felt a bit weak the last weeks but thought it's nothing ... turns out I'm wrong apparently.

Ouch, get well soon! I really hope our societies will learn from this outbreak, and be more well-prepared in the future. It's definitely an extreme stress test for all the affected countries.

 

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1 hour ago, astralprojection said:

u srs bro? damn ... take care man, i wish you luck .. :( 

unfortunately yes ... but I have not been coughing up any red today at least...

20 hours ago, Diaks said:

Ouch, get well soon! I really hope our societies will learn from this outbreak, and be more well-prepared in the future. It's definitely an extreme stress test for all the affected countries.

 

Thanks ... I really hope the whole world will learn from this - and will be a better place afterwards...

21 hours ago, Padmapani said:

the thing with the tests and risk zones is beyond ridiculous by now.

what lung problems have you had before? any fever now? from what i've read in the scientific literature, it'd be very unusual to go staight from just feeling weak to coughing blood without typical pneumonia symptoms in between. also covid-19 does usually progress to serious illness, if it does at all, in a matter of no more than two weeks. if it's not covid-19 it's probably for the best if they don't collect you now and put you in with covid-19 patients when you're already coughing up blood now.

didn't they say that anyone who gets advised to do a test by a doctor will get one now? or is it just the usual thing of "shorty" lying as soon as he opens his mouth…
what about the drive-in stations they put up in all kinds of places?

anyway, all the best. get well soon and fuck our chaotic, bureaucratic way of managing this crisis.

Thanks for the info ... yes, it also deemed unusal to me ... but I had about three weeks of slight "feling sick" before, so maybe that was it already? That's at least what made the doctor think it's a suspected Covid-19...

I am flattered by the arguments from the people at our Covid-19 hotline ... they are nice and all, but denying that test is really bad. There are no drive-in tests in Vienna yet ... and even if there were, you'd need to pre-register via the hotline ... which they denied...

I have no bloody cough anymore, but a serious shortage of breath when lying down - i.e. sleeping. This worries me a lot right now, because I cannot get enough sleep :( 
I can get up and even walk around in the flat without major problems ... there's slight pain in the lung area and an occasional cough, but I'd call it "mild symptoms" ... but when I lie down, "all hell breaks loose" - the problem is, I do have anxiety and this worsens everything a huge deal. 
Temperature is 37,3 by the way ... just slightly raised. Normally I wouldn't be concerned about this...

I slept half an hour in the morning today and afterwards I felt like I had just climbed a mountain. What on earth is this? 

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that shortness of breath does sound a little suspicious. i think you should get tested. don't hesitate to call again if it gets any worse. keep us updated and take care.

that thing with lying down reminds me of what my parents told me a few weeks ago. they both were sick but comparatively fine in the afternoon, but had a bad cough with a little shortness of breath when lying down at night and frequently woke up because of the coughing.

i myself have had a little raised temperature (about 37,2) for 10 days together with feeling exhausted (might also have been due to stress at work) and a burning sensation in the bronchi, that caused me to stop smoking for the whole time (which i've never done due to sickness before) maybe two weeks ago. nothing major at all, not worse than the usual sniffles you get in winter, but the burning was unusual.

we're all fine now, but considering the wide range of symptoms, going from nothing at all to life-threatening, and how little we still know of the disease i'd really like to know if that was it or i'm just overly attentive when any such symptoms are mentioned in a situation like this one. i've got an antibody test coming in the mail (the kind of test that is only positive 1-2 weeks after the infection) soon. the more data we have the better. if any of us has a positive result the official numbers are just the tip of a giant iceberg, which would also make covid-19 a lot less dangerous as most cases would be relatively mild and go unrecognised.

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results are negative for all of us. so if the tests are as good as the manufacturer claims (5% false negatives), there are a few other viruses out there with similar symptoms (dry cough, tiredness, lung pain, raised temperature, no clogged nose or sneezing at all)

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Hey, what you describe sounds exactly like I've been feeling since the last 3 weeks - but I suspect I got a reinfection: I was sick at first, felt quite bad, then got better after about 10 days, went out and to work again, also went for extended walks and such ... then it got worse again and I feel like in another "10 day cycle" -- only strange thing was the bloody cough and the shortness of breath. It got better now, the blood is practically gone and the breathing feels better. Two tiny red dots in the morning cough today ... nothing to worry about. But I am staying alert ... if it worsens I will not hesitate to call the hotlines again.

My dad (an old man and a risk person) has the same symptoms like you describe. A burn in the bronchi and a medium sore throat that gets very dry in the morning ... but he'd rather be carried out by the paramedics than call the hotline, I have tried to convince him already :P 

The fact that your tests were negative makes me some hope that it's not Covid-19 what we have. Maybe there is another weaker virus out there that causes these symptoms (*). The blood that I coughed is the only odd and worrisome thing. I will get this checked as soon as I can, but at the moment I must stay home.

(*) and maybe - odd theory - if this weak undetected virus and covid-19 come together, there is a drastically higher risk to cause a hospitalization
Another way how I put it is: if this is Covid-19, so be it ... but if it's not, I pray I never get Covid-19 because the outlook is grim when I already have such trouble with a weaker virus right now!

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19 hours ago, RTP said:

The fact that your tests were negative makes me some hope that it's not Covid-19 what we have. Maybe there is another weaker virus out there that causes these symptoms (*). The blood that I coughed is the only odd and worrisome thing. I will get this checked as soon as I can, but at the moment I must stay home.

(*) and maybe - odd theory - if this weak undetected virus and covid-19 come together, there is a drastically higher risk to cause a hospitalization
Another way how I put it is: if this is Covid-19, so be it ... but if it's not, I pray I never get Covid-19 because the outlook is grim when I already have such trouble with a weaker virus right now!

there are something like viruses constantly floating around in the population that cause the common cold (including 4 types of relatively harmless coronaviruses). many of them could be responsible here.

definitely. that's one of the reasons people were fearing a fast spread of covid-10 while influenza was still circulating everywhere some time ago. if you get both influenza and covid-19 at the same time, you'll likely have a pretty bad time.

the biphasic course of the disease could either be bacterial superinfection (while your immune system is occupied with fighting off pretty much any virus it doesn't really care about bacteria that much. after all a virus can produce hundreds of copies of itself in the time a bacterium takes to divide into two new cells) or it could be covid-19. people also report feeling better for a day or two after a week or so before it comes back for another week. but i honestly have no idea how to explain that. after about one week your antibody production ramps up noticably helping you win the battle against the virus/bacterium/whatever. so if it's indeed not just a few odd cases but a characteristic of sars-cov-2 there must be something going on we don't yet fully know yet.

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Hi ... thanks for the info. Here's an update: I am now an official "suspected case" - meaning I got a test. I had to mention several times that my doctor specifically wants this test...
The guys in white were at the door yesterday and took my samples.
I need a result either way -- after talking to my doctor I do not even suspect it to be positive anymore, but I need a negative result on paper to be able to visit doctors. Nobody treats you without protective gear when you say you have temperature and shortness of breath - and doctors aren't properly equipped :P 

The result needs up to 3 days ... no joke <_<
But I am happy that it happens!

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that's good news!

but i really wonder what takes them so long to get to the test results. it procedure involves something like 30 min sample cleanup, 30min of combining ingredients for the test (if you want to fill up the thermocycles with lots of samples) and then letting the machine run for 5h.
i could understand if they collect samples from one entire day, then let the thermocycler run overnight, but even then you'd have a result in the next morning.

anyway, keep us updated with the results.

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Terribly sorry to hear how many are suffering, whatever version we got it was not as bad as any of this. I hope all recover ok & heal. Much love & respect to all fellow psynews crew.

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Hello - new update: IT IS OFFICIALLY COVID-19

Yesterday the problems got so bad that I called 911 and got checked up in the hospital! In the course of this chceckup, the hospital did a NEW Corona test and the result of this NEW test has been positive!

On 4/11/2020 at 12:19 AM, Padmapani said:

that's good news!

but i really wonder what takes them so long to get to the test results. it procedure involves something like 30 min sample cleanup, 30min of combining ingredients for the test (if you want to fill up the thermocycles with lots of samples) and then letting the machine run for 5h.
i could understand if they collect samples from one entire day, then let the thermocycler run overnight, but even then you'd have a result in the next morning.

anyway, keep us updated with the results.

Hey, I have no clue what takes them so long for the initial test results to arrive. The doctor from the ambulance gave a hint: I overheard he suspects that they've lost my sample as he talked to a colleague. A second brigade came to me on Friday for another test ... no sign of that one either. It's a mess!

Fortunately the people at the hospitals are better trained and more accurate. I just got the news from the doctor from the hospital they took me to yesterday.

So my problems ... it is weird: it seems I have nightly Hypopnea ("Hypopnoe" in German) and also Apnea ... my breathing gets lower and lower and lower until it stops completely - I then have to wake up and consciously re-initiate the breathing! This process only happens when I do not breathe consciously, such as when going to sleep. That was the reason to call ambulance - unfortulately I did it in the morning and the symptoms were away during the day ... but they checked me through and let me out again, so yeah. The doctor on the phone saw no indication that I should return to the hospital, so I will try to battle it at home then - but when impossible I'll call ambulance.

There is almost no mucus at all in the lungs, by the way. Only very slight cough and a temperature of 37,2 - and even that went away, in the hospital they measured 36,8.
The only odd thing was coughing blood one time. And now this nightly Apnea.

Everybody out there please be careful! 

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6 hours ago, RTP said:

Hello - new update: IT IS OFFICIALLY COVID-19

thanks for the update.

at least you finally got the test. it really is a mess. while i would have expected them to have less peopel working over easter, i would not have thought that they lose their samples. unglaublich, so a schlamperei. at least those in the hospital are a bit better prepared. to which hospital did you go?

the hypopnea/apoe is really surprising here. i did another search but found zero mention in the literature available about covid-19. did you take any cough or pain medication (basically opioids)? or have you noticed that you aren't well rested after sleeping before your symptoms began? i have no idea how the virus could cause this, especially when you only have relatively mild symptoms otherwise (except the blood of course), but in real life medicine anything is possible…

this also makes me question if looking for fever as a symptom is of much or any use with covid-19.

all the best and a quick recovery!

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21 hours ago, Padmapani said:

thanks for the update.

at least you finally got the test. it really is a mess. while i would have expected them to have less peopel working over easter, i would not have thought that they lose their samples. unglaublich, so a schlamperei. at least those in the hospital are a bit better prepared. to which hospital did you go?

the hypopnea/apoe is really surprising here. i did another search but found zero mention in the literature available about covid-19. did you take any cough or pain medication (basically opioids)? or have you noticed that you aren't well rested after sleeping before your symptoms began? i have no idea how the virus could cause this, especially when you only have relatively mild symptoms otherwise (except the blood of course), but in real life medicine anything is possible…

this also makes me question if looking for fever as a symptom is of much or any use with covid-19.

all the best and a quick recovery!

The things that happen with the tests here are really a mess. I still have no result from the first two...

Yes, the hypopnea / apnea is very strange also to all doctors I talked to about it. I am suspecting that I had a condition already and the virus worsened it greatly. I was a snorer, as people who I traveled with reported - and I have had the occasional case of being not well rested after the night. But never to this extent ... so I suspect that the virus made it greatly worse -- would be logical: the lungs can currently not take the strain of my "ordinary sleep apnea condition" (which was hardly noticeable before) now that they are stressed out with the Covid-19...

I don't take any opioids, don't need them as I have not much of a cough.

I have been prescribed a bronchodilatador (emergency asthma medication) - this helps with breathing in the night, but it does not fully cure the process that I do not breathe by myself. It's very weird. I have to watch it closely and call ambulance if it's not bearable - will do that.

Fever is of no use at all as an indicator. I have just a bit raised temperature such as 37,2...

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Quote

I have been prescribed a bronchodilatador (emergency asthma medication) - this helps with breathing in the night, but it does not fully cure the process that I do not breathe by myself. It's very weird. I have to watch it closely and call ambulance if it's not bearable - will do that.

maybe you have fluids in your lungs, which seem to happen with covid, better get to the hospital sooner than later and get it checked out. good luck to you. 

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Hello ... I have managed without another 911 call so far. Tonight I'd say it's the first time that there is a little bit of light shimmering in the tunnel ... let's hope it won't be a train.

What is odd is that the temperature rose to 37,5 yesterday and I got a bit of a sore throat now - but I believe this might be my own immune system finally checking "hey, there is something in the system that we need to get rid of". I'll watch it closely, but I feel a bit better ("better by the margin of the thickness of a coin" is the wording that came to me in the night) ... so I'll just hang on.

I have came across this video and I am now in a good enough state to watch what this "thing" is doing to me ... really interesting - and it also explains the blood coughing in my opinion. You should watch it, it might prevent damage:

Cytokine storms are mentioned too - but they don't seem so dangerous, it's just a natural body reaction, right? Or did I miss something there?

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Cytokine storms are mentioned too - but they don't seem so dangerous, it's just a natural body reaction, right? Or did I miss something there?

i think you missed something there. worst case scenario; they are extremely dangerous and basically its the immune system going into hyperdrive killing all your internal organs in the process, causing heart attacks and god knows what else, and results in death. and there is no known cure for it. 

but, its not fatal all the times, many people here in sweden seem to pull through, after said storm. i think the numbers here are 80% living through the Intensive care unit, where all the cytokine storm and hypoxemia patients are. 

Theres also doctors saying the oxygen thing is like high altitude sickness, and that the lungs are okay and the damage to the lungs seen in pictures (the white lungs) are from ventilators themselves damaging the lungs. but somehow there is not a transmission of oxygen from the lungs to the bloodstream.

 

hopefully they figure this thing out sooner than later and can correctly start to treat people, god knows how many lungs have been damaged due to overcompression from the ventilators :/ when in fact the problem lies elsewhere.

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3 hours ago, astralprojection said:

i think you missed something there. worst case scenario; they are extremely dangerous and basically its the immune system going into hyperdrive killing all your internal organs in the process, causing heart attacks and god knows what else, and results in death. and there is no known cure for it. 

but, its not fatal all the times, many people here in sweden seem to pull through, after said storm. i think the numbers here are 80% living through the Intensive care unit, where all the cytokine storm and hypoxemia patients are. 

hopefully they figure this thing out sooner than later and can correctly start to treat people, god knows how many lungs have been damaged due to overcompression from the ventilators :/ when in fact the problem lies elsewhere.

uh, thanks for clarifying ... I indeed missed something there then about the Cytokine storms :( ... sounds not good at all

Quote

Theres also doctors saying the oxygen thing is like high altitude sickness, and that the lungs are okay and the damage to the lungs seen in pictures (the white lungs) are from ventilators themselves damaging the lungs. but somehow there is not a transmission of oxygen from the lungs to the bloodstream.

YES! I am no doctor but I would agree ... an awful lot of this sickness reminds me of my pneumonia in Peru which was in high altitude, symptoms are similar ... only the blood was not there back then. The doctors who checked me saw no damaged lungs, but I have trouble getting enough air - there definitely is not enough oxygen passing into the bloodstream I would say! Bronchodilatadors help a little with this, fortunately...

Please everybody stay safe!! All the best!!

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20 hours ago, RTP said:

uh, thanks for clarifying ... I indeed missed something there then about the Cytokine storms :( ... sounds not good at all

YES! I am no doctor but I would agree ... an awful lot of this sickness reminds me of my pneumonia in Peru which was in high altitude, symptoms are similar ... only the blood was not there back then. The doctors who checked me saw no damaged lungs, but I have trouble getting enough air - there definitely is not enough oxygen passing into the bloodstream I would say! Bronchodilatadors help a little with this, fortunately...

Please everybody stay safe!! All the best!!

Man please get to a respirator if you have even worse trouble breathing. :s I hope it gets better.

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17 hours ago, Penzoline said:

Man please get to a respirator if you have even worse trouble breathing. :s I hope it gets better.

Thanks, yes I was monitoring it closely ... it's now slowly getting better here - so I don't think I need it. Hoping that it will go further up ... it looks like it! I was able to sleep in the night and feel better today.

The reason why I was reluctant to call 911 is: in the hospital I might suffer from additional infection - especially the one they took me to, my dad was in there some months ago and he developed a bad lung inflammation which he contacted in the hospital - which fortunately was cured with antibiotics, but I suspect that is one of these hospital germs ... and I'm afraid of those, because if Covid-19 and these come together, it's really bad.
I called around doctors if somebody would get me some oxygen ... but nobody of them could. I managed with the bronchodilatador alone.
And since the problems were only there in the night, I tried to lie awake more and then sleep on the day...

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On 4/14/2020 at 8:39 PM, RTP said:

The things that happen with the tests here are really a mess. I still have no result from the first two...

Yes, the hypopnea / apnea is very strange also to all doctors I talked to about it. I am suspecting that I had a condition already and the virus worsened it greatly. I was a snorer, as people who I traveled with reported - and I have had the occasional case of being not well rested after the night. But never to this extent ... so I suspect that the virus made it greatly worse -- would be logical: the lungs can currently not take the strain of my "ordinary sleep apnea condition" (which was hardly noticeable before) now that they are stressed out with the Covid-19...

I don't take any opioids, don't need them as I have not much of a cough.

I have been prescribed a bronchodilatador (emergency asthma medication) - this helps with breathing in the night, but it does not fully cure the process that I do not breathe by myself. It's very weird. I have to watch it closely and call ambulance if it's not bearable - will do that.

Fever is of no use at all as an indicator. I have just a bit raised temperature such as 37,2...

that seems like the most likely explanation. if you had very mild sleep apnea you might not have noticed it before and not need any sort of treatment usually, it could very well become noticable when you have an infection in your lungs.

 

On 4/16/2020 at 1:25 PM, RTP said:

 Cytokine storms are mentioned too - but they don't seem so dangerous, it's just a natural body reaction, right? Or did I miss something there?

 

On 4/16/2020 at 4:20 PM, astralprojection said:

i think you missed something there. worst case scenario; they are extremely dangerous and basically its the immune system going into hyperdrive killing all your internal organs in the process, causing heart attacks and god knows what else, and results in death. and there is no known cure for it. 

but, its not fatal all the times, many people here in sweden seem to pull through, after said storm. i think the numbers here are 80% living through the Intensive care unit, where all the cytokine storm and hypoxemia patients are. 

Theres also doctors saying the oxygen thing is like high altitude sickness, and that the lungs are okay and the damage to the lungs seen in pictures (the white lungs) are from ventilators themselves damaging the lungs. but somehow there is not a transmission of oxygen from the lungs to the bloodstream.

hopefully they figure this thing out sooner than later and can correctly start to treat people, god knows how many lungs have been damaged due to overcompression from the ventilators :/ when in fact the problem lies elsewhere.

we had a whole semester course on hypoxia/lung failure at university.

so yeah, a cytokine storm is not just a normal reaction of the immune system. it's going into overdrive releasing so many messenger molecules that attract too many immune cells to the point of inflammation leading to tissue damage and making all those immune cells clog your blood vessels. this is ultimately what causes multi-organ failure because the oxygen in your lungs cannot be transported to the rest of the body without the appropriate blood flow. also the organs that receive most blood flow in your body (kidneys) can also get clogged.

the good news is that it's not something to worry about at home. it's rather what gets you from serious but stable condition when you're already in the intensive care unit to a 50/50 chance of survival.

 

the ventilators do cause lung damage if you're on them for too long (they also increase the chances of superinfection), but no one is put on a ventilator if it's not strictly necessary. doctors know the dangers of ventilators well enough. so when you cannot get the oxygen you need by breathing normally you'll first be given oxygen. as you increase the oxygen concentration of the air you get from 20% to almost 100% you can get (roughly estimated) five times the amount of oxygen per breath as you'd usually would. this is enough for most cases and only if the condition worsens enough that this is still not sufficient to get enough oxygen into the bloodstream people will be put on a ventilator.

 

On 4/18/2020 at 10:36 AM, RTP said:

Thanks, yes I was monitoring it closely ... it's now slowly getting better here - so I don't think I need it. Hoping that it will go further up ... it looks like it! I was able to sleep in the night and feel better today.

The reason why I was reluctant to call 911 is: in the hospital I might suffer from additional infection - especially the one they took me to, my dad was in there some months ago and he developed a bad lung inflammation which he contacted in the hospital - which fortunately was cured with antibiotics, but I suspect that is one of these hospital germs ... and I'm afraid of those, because if Covid-19 and these come together, it's really bad.
I called around doctors if somebody would get me some oxygen ... but nobody of them could. I managed with the bronchodilatador alone.
And since the problems were only there in the night, I tried to lie awake more and then sleep on the day...

good to hear you're feeling better!

staying out of hospital is definitely a good idea if you don't need it. getting a bacerial superinfection in the hospital together with covid was a problem in china in february.

bronchodilators are effective first line treatment here. i give them out to people with all kinds of respiratory infections multiple times every day. i'm no doctor but i don't think oxygen would have been the right next step here with you having no troubles breathing at day. it's rather something usually given to copd patients or in hospitals. for more serious sleep apnea a cpap-mask is the standard treatment. it just applies a little pressure to keep the airways open as usual at night despite the muscles around the throat area relaxing. but even this would be overkill right now imho.

anyway, a speedy recovery! (i'm sure you'll be much better soon. the usual time between first complaints to a doctor and recovery is somewhere around two weeks)

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  • 3 weeks later...

Hello ... an update again, I have been staying low the past 2 weeks and it got better, I was able to go out again ... and yesterday I was at the lung doctor and got a check up: lungs are OK.

I do still have the one or other bad night ... but I hope that it will not go really bad again. I have returned to work and so far I'm alright.

Sports will have to wait. For the moment I am "NRTP" : "not running to psytrance" ...

The doctor recommeded me a check for sleep apnea which will be done in June in first steps ... if I get results, I might post them here for completion.

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thanks for the update. i was a little worried not seeing any posts for the last two weeks. good to hear you're feeling better. 
though i am surprised that it takes such a long time. this virus sure is a nasty thing…

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