Lemmiwinks Posted November 11, 2014 Share Posted November 11, 2014 Hi everyone, Don't know about you guys but lately I find pleasure in listening to just about anything BUT psytrance (I never thought the day would come...). The thing is basically everywhere alse you look there is evolution in music, for example dubstep came out of nowhere a few years back, now it morphed into trap, even commercial trance DJs are now playing mostly EDM, not to mention modern "radio" tracks that basically sound like slowed-down hardcore, these are very interesting times... EXCEPT for psytrance where I get the feeling that everything sounds EXACTLY the same as it did (at least) 10 years ago! And this is valid for all substyles I'm familiar with, ranging from progressive to dark to (not-so) newschool, forest, you name it.This really contrasts with the turn of the century where I had the feeling that a new subgenre would come out like every 6 months. The only real "evolution" that I have heard is putting dubstep parts in the breaks, although that doesn't really change the overall predictability of the track once the break is over. So anyway, since I don't want this to be the 1000th topic of compaining how things were better "back then", I'm wondering, are there any new directions or even substyles that have happened recently? Anything to take psytrance to a new level? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scandinasia Posted November 11, 2014 Share Posted November 11, 2014 Goa/Psy-influenced Tech Trance maybe ? It's a crossover of Uplifting Trance, (dark) Progressive and Goa-ish Full-on. It is a fresh new trend (began in 2013, developped this year.) Perfect example : Trizet - Aqua Driftsorm - Ignorance https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kOL548i-PbA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8MoltyYRaM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0r5HFreDGc Manifestor - Beyond Illusions Hi-Tech is not that old either, especially the 200+ bpm trend. EDIT : Altar Records is also developping a new formula : Psychedelic Progressive Chilltrance. Alwoods, Akshan, Cabeiri, Astropilot, E-Mantra do this now. It is uptempo with dreamy sounds and Goa echoes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Padmapani Posted November 11, 2014 Share Posted November 11, 2014 The thing is basically everywhere alse you look there is evolution in music, for example dubstep came out of nowhere a few years back, now it morphed into trap, even commercial trance DJs are now playing mostly EDM, not to mention modern "radio" tracks that basically sound like slowed-down hardcore, these are very interesting times... no way. there's not a lot of evolution in edm out side of psytrance either. it's rather that we get "new genres" with new names that basically all sound like one substyle of one genre in the 90s. trap is almost identical with a certain style of what used to be called miami bass. microhouse is now called minimal techno (and what used to be called minimal techno has disappeared). chicago hard house is (or was? is it still around?) called jumpstyle. and the successor to eurodance (which is confusingly called edm - "electronic dance music" - which used to be the umbrella term for all danceable electronic music; therefore trance dj's playing edm isn't something new, they've done that the whole time), albeit sounding a little different this time, is still as pukeworthy as commercial house variants have always been. the only things that's new is dubstep (and dubstep has disappeared as fast as it appeared). btw, dubstep used to be the name for dub-influenced dnb... so if psytrance was like the rest of edm, then we'd have a completely new genre, where everyone would agree that it has nothing to do whatsoever with goa, of which all tracks sounded almost exactly like elysium and it would be called "jungle". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Padmapani Posted November 11, 2014 Share Posted November 11, 2014 EXCEPT for psytrance where I get the feeling that everything sounds EXACTLY the same as it did (at least) 10 years ago! quite the opposite, sadly. darkpsy, much of which was good 10 years ago has been supplanted by psycore/hitech. fullon has all but disappeared, progressive has morphed into sped-up minimal techno with a squelch here and there and dubstep breaks. on the upside, goa was nonexistent 10 years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scandinasia Posted November 11, 2014 Share Posted November 11, 2014 Full-on has devolved into Goa and Prog. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desysko Posted November 11, 2014 Share Posted November 11, 2014 Haha, that's quite funny to read considering how Full-on came to existence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cybernetika Posted November 11, 2014 Share Posted November 11, 2014 quite the opposite, sadly. darkpsy, much of which was good 10 years ago has been supplanted by psycore/hitech. Absolutely agree with this. Also, what got me interested in Psy around 10 years ago is the focus on atmosphere...Some of it had much more coherent soundscapes, it was a style that I would label as "explorative music", something that encourages you to discover something underneath the surface. Atmospheres can much better transport a certain setting, be it wisely used samples, drones, pads, stuff like this. I miss this in a lot of Darkpsy now, sadly. In my opinion, a lot of modern Psy seems too "dry" to me. A lot of the stuff is too clean, too raw, and too much in your face. I honestly prefer it if there are more layers of interesting sounds, effects, melodies, etc. A lot of Psy might try to sound "wetter" and "deeper" than average EDM but in the end its not much more than just putting a dub delay on a random vocal sample, like some cheap magic tricks that keep you entertained as long as you have not seen the truth ...anyway, to be honest, at least 95% of full on or Progressive does not do anything for me. When I think about innovative Dark Psy, I must automatically reach back into that time around 10-15 years ago. X-Dream, Spirallianz and The Delta had an impressive take on Techno-Psy, but that style has almost disappeared completely. Nowadays it seems that the only Psy-Tech you can get is some sort of minimal Techno, which is utterly boring to me. Then there was a fusion of Dark Psy and Goa, something that comes to mind when I think about the brilliant album 'Technological' by Toi Doi, which is around 15 years old now if I am not mistaken. Or think about Tim Schuldt/Four Carry Nuts, who made a crazy mix of Dark Psy, Full On and Industrial, end 90s to early 00s. These were shining examples and brilliant ideas on the evolution of a genre, and I know not too few people who feel similarly about this, however all of these great ideas are more or less extinct, which is a damn shame. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Padmapani Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 ^ couldn't agree more, on all accounts. modern psy is severely lacking in atmosphere. most fullon and also darkpsy back then really painted a nice abstract soundscape, but that is completely lost now. the only modern thing that comes close (except goa obviously) is the occasional serbian style progressive (e-clip's first album, some ovnimoon, ...). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cynos Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 EXCEPT for psytrance where I get the feeling that everything sounds EXACTLY the same as it did (at least) 10 years ago! Just look how actual full-on has turned into speeded-up electro and progressive into a bassline with some random Vengeance samples. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lemmiwinks Posted November 12, 2014 Author Share Posted November 12, 2014 thanks for you replies people, especially Scandinasia for those recomendations, nice to hear something fresh shounding As for the evolution/ devolution of psytrance humm well the way I see it it's simply that there's a lot more progressive and a lot less full-on than before, although I always found that most uninspired full-on was basically progressive with a loud bassline anyway, this being true ever since the turn of the century and the "evolution" of minimal. I guess there's just something with psytrance and having a monotonous 4/4 kicks and bassline with a little break and wooosh sound every now and then Hmm yeah, Hitek is more recent than darkpsy although IMO they use the exact same formulas just with the tempo a bit (a lot?) higher so I wouldn't really consider it really something new... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archetype Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 Nowadays I hardly listen to any new psytrance/goa. Only psychedelic techfunk, psychedelic disco and some psybreaks still tickle my brain. And these are not new genres. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cynos Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 Nowadays I hardly listen to any new psytrance/goa. Only psychedelic techfunk, psychedelic disco and some psybreaks still tickle my brain. And these are not new genres. Same here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trance2MoveU Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 You guys seem to have more discerning tastes than I. Perhaps more refined. I would say for the greater part of a decade psy/goa is the lion's share of music I listen to. I recently did a huge cull of old full-on releases and purchased a ton of twilight music that still gets the blood pumping. Always loved the old days of goa and still love and collect the newer stuff. While it may not be groundbreaking (some are) the detail and increased production values allow me to get deep into music. But ultimately it really depends on what you're in the mood for doesn't it? Know what I was listening to yesterday? Earth Wind and Fire - September. That song is probably older than everyone on this forum except me. And it's a classic feel good song. That was followed by some gospel song that I can't name, but because my wife sung the hell out of it (she's really good) I listened to it. And then to top it off I'm learning how to play Easy by Lionel Richie on the piano. And right now? Gangnia It Came From the 4th Dimension. Album is bad-ass yo. I guess what I would say is that there is so much music out there, current and classic, to fulfill everyone's mood. Don't really know how psy could change, but albums like Kiriyama's, Ianuaria's, Tryon, and comps like Temple of One really invite repeated listens and appreciation. Whew. Did I write anything...anything at all relevant to the topic? Mdk 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filthysock Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Wow...The genre was my favourite thing growing up and I just fell out of it for a few years and coming back I think it's refreshing and awesome, and there's so much of it to dig into. I guess you should never grind the same old gears of any genre too long, and allow your curiosity to take you elsehwere. Lately I mix it up with dub mostly... : PChecking out other related genre's that were mentioned here I stumbled across this track which starts on 37:57... it's amazing:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yluxX0o6PagI would include it in my Psy-Trance mix. It delivers the same effect, just a different groove. I think the whole genre should be open to implementing different grooves more often without concern of sticking to the original genre or whatever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
franki Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 I think there's plenty of variety in psytrance to keep me interested. I listen to it all the time! I think you're spoiled for choice now tbh, back in the 90s there was really only Goa, but these days there are enough sub-genres I enjoy to stop me getting bored of psy. New developments are slow coming through maybe, but you could say that for most types of music. If it's decent and works, why would you want to radically change a genre? Trends come and go - super fast hi-tech is on the rise for sure, certainly in the UK, (some of which I like,) dubstep breaks as already mentioned too (which I'm not fond of at all!) I'm open to most styles. My least favourite (and least CDs bought!) would be Iboga / Iono type prog (which I find pretty boring and uninvolving), Israeli style full-on (too many commercial dance music tricks employed for my liking,) and a lot of Nitzho (again, too cheesy for me and the middle-eastern melodies do my head in! ) but there is still music I like from there sub-genres, also. Goa (new & old), Twilight, Forest, Night-time / Dark, Hi-tech, Zenonesque prog - all good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotwang Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 New developments are slow coming through maybe, but you could say that for most types of music. If it's decent and works, why would you want to radically change a genre? Well, for me and I'm sure many other people, a large part of what makes music psychedelic is that it sounds unlike things we're used to hearing. There's only so many times the same ideas can be recycled before they become overly familiar so I think that innovation and evolution are more important for psytrance than they are for most other genres. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lemmiwinks Posted November 14, 2014 Author Share Posted November 14, 2014 You guys seem to have more discerning tastes than I. Perhaps more refined. I would say for the greater part of a decade psy/goa is the lion's share of music I listen to. I recently did a huge cull of old full-on releases and purchased a ton of twilight music that still gets the blood pumping. Always loved the old days of goa and still love and collect the newer stuff. While it may not be groundbreaking (some are) the detail and increased production values allow me to get deep into music. But ultimately it really depends on what you're in the mood for doesn't it? Know what I was listening to yesterday? Earth Wind and Fire - September. That song is probably older than everyone on this forum except me. And it's a classic feel good song. That was followed by some gospel song that I can't name, but because my wife sung the hell out of it (she's really good) I listened to it. And then to top it off I'm learning how to play Easy by Lionel Richie on the piano. And right now? Gangnia It Came From the 4th Dimension. Album is bad-ass yo. I guess what I would say is that there is so much music out there, current and classic, to fulfill everyone's mood. Don't really know how psy could change, but albums like Kiriyama's, Ianuaria's, Tryon, and comps like Temple of One really invite repeated listens and appreciation. Whew. Did I write anything...anything at all relevant to the topic? Mdk amen to that, although back in the days it would have been like 80% psy and 20% other music, these days it's more like 5% psy and 95% other music, I actually have more fun listening to what they call EDM than psy... Wow... The genre was my favourite thing growing up and I just fell out of it for a few years and coming back I think it's refreshing and awesome, and there's so much of it to dig into. I guess you should never grind the same old gears of any genre too long, and allow your curiosity to take you elsehwere. Lately I mix it up with dub mostly... : P Checking out other related genre's that were mentioned here I stumbled across this track which starts on 37:57... it's amazing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yluxX0o6Pag I would include it in my Psy-Trance mix. It delivers the same effect, just a different groove. I think the whole genre should be open to implementing different grooves more often without concern of sticking to the original genre or whatever. Ah well that's exactly it, I've always had my "on-and-off" periods as well the problem is that back then I'd stay away from the scene for a few months and would be amazed to see how many fresh ideas would be around when I came back, however this isn't the case anymore today. Ok, in all honesty I have stumbled on a few interesting tracks like Phaxe - Angels of Destruction but overall I'm really getting the feeling that every substyle sounds almost exactly the same as it did a decade ago (well, except hitek although that's not really my cup of tea...) Well, for me and I'm sure many other people, a large part of what makes music psychedelic is that it sounds unlike things we're used to hearing. There's only so many times the same ideas can be recycled before they become overly familiar so I think that innovation and evolution are more important for psytrance than they are for most other genres. totally agree!! Psytrance was all about "music for the future", I remember when I was a kid we'd joke with some friends saying that this is the kind of music that aliens from an advanced civilization listen to, it's not the case anymore today IMO... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purple Sunray Posted November 14, 2014 Share Posted November 14, 2014 Well, for me and I'm sure many other people, a large part of what makes music psychedelic is that it sounds unlike things we're used to hearing. There's only so many times the same ideas can be recycled before they become overly familiar so I think that innovation and evolution are more important for psytrance than they are for most other genres. I don't think that such people have a problem with innovation on the psy genres. I'm same.. I mainly listen to psy because there is such a huge variety of soundscapes.. from 130 to 200bpm.. from trancey to funky .. from cheesy to experimental .. from funny to aggressive .. you can find everything.. if you want. I only hear ppl complaining about missing innovation, that at the same time complain about that there is no more sound like it was on good old days.. cuz prog sucks and fullon sucks and dark sucks and hi-tech even more. Only thing that's ok is new-school goa.. but it sounds like old-school goa, no innovation.. BOOOOOORING !! :( -.- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purple Sunray Posted November 14, 2014 Share Posted November 14, 2014 totally agree!! Psytrance was all about "music for the future", I remember when I was a kid we'd joke with some friends saying that this is the kind of music that aliens from an advanced civilization listen to, it's not the case anymore today IMO... I don't agree with that. It's the case for the 'mainstream' sound, because they want to be mainstream (which is kind of the opposite to innovation). I mean.. I can even find new interesting sounds on the perma-bashed fullon genre.. http://www.beatport.com/track/you-need-more-light-original-mix/6011728 Hypereegs debug EP.. released yesterday and I really love it.. mainly because it hasn't a lot in common with well known cheesy blingbling fullon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lemmiwinks Posted November 14, 2014 Author Share Posted November 14, 2014 I don't agree with that. It's the case for the 'mainstream' sound, because they want to be mainstream (which is kind of the opposite to innovation). I mean.. I can even find new interesting sounds on the perma-bashed fullon genre.. http://www.beatport.com/track/you-need-more-light-original-mix/6011728 Hypereegs debug EP.. released yesterday and I really love it.. mainly because it hasn't a lot in common with well known cheesy blingbling fullon ummm... and just how is that any different from the million-or-so other dark full-on tracks?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purple Sunray Posted November 14, 2014 Share Posted November 14, 2014 well.. how is Metallica different to all milliard-or-so other rock tracks? Sounds all totally the same for me.. because I don't like (and understand) this kind of music, so I don't listen to details, but details are what makes it different. Might this be the reason why you can't find anything interesting anymore? You just lost interest and if you are not interested on sometihng you don't care about details. I mean.. my girlfriend constantly flames me about the type of music I listen too.. wtf.. 6min of bom bom bom what a boring bullish! She can't even hear a difference between kindzadza and david guetta, all just electronic bom bom bom. > ummm... and just how is that any different from the million-or-so other dark full-on tracks?? Explained above - listen to "you need more light".. now please post me a track that has that same fussing-synth shots as you heart on the beginning of the preview, or the same funky-flow as after the drop, or.. You get what i mean? You listen to it and think "omg again .. dark fullon" .. i listen to it and think "cool fussing-synth, never heart this before" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lemmiwinks Posted November 14, 2014 Author Share Posted November 14, 2014 well.. how is Metallica different to all milliard-or-so other rock tracks? Sounds all totally the same for me.. because I don't like (and understand) this kind of music, so I don't listen to details, but details are what makes it different. Might this be the reason why you can't find anything interesting anymore? You just lost interest and if you are not interested on sometihng you don't care about details. I mean.. my girlfriend constantly flames me about the type of music I listen too.. wtf.. 6min of bom bom bom what a boring bullish! She can't even hear a difference between kindzadza and david guetta, all just electronic bom bom bom. > ummm... and just how is that any different from the million-or-so other dark full-on tracks?? Explained above - listen to "you need more light".. now please post me a track that has that same fussing-synth shots as you heart on the beginning of the preview, or the same funky-flow as after the drop, or.. You get what i mean? You listen to it and think "omg again .. dark fullon" .. i listen to it and think "cool fussing-synth, never heart this before" hmm yeah I kindof get what you're saying and you're right, the more you don't feel attracted to a certain type of music, the more you have a tendency to dismiss it in the "don't like" pile without really paying attention to it (unless you're high and then you get amazed by the slightest high-hat sound haha ). However this is kindof my point from the beginning, I don't find a real leap in evolution in psytrance, if there is one it's only slight details (well, obviously there has to be SOME variation or else the artists would have copyright issues). Say, a difference like between X-Dream - Our Own Happiness and X-Dream - Peeter's Hoover. Only 5 years separate these tracks, yet there's a world of a difference between them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Purple Sunray Posted November 14, 2014 Share Posted November 14, 2014 hmm yeah I kindof get what you're saying and you're right, the more you don't feel attracted to a certain type of music, the more you have a tendency to dismiss it in the "don't like" pile without really paying attention to it (unless you're high and then you get amazed by the slightest high-hat sound haha ). However this is kindof my point from the beginning, I don't find a real leap in evolution in psytrance, if there is one it's only slight details (well, obviously there has to be SOME variation or else the artists would have copyright issues). Say, a difference like between X-Dream - Our Own Happiness and X-Dream - Peeter's Hoover. Only 5 years separate these tracks, yet there's a world of a difference between them. I also get what you mean - I just don't agree to that The posted tracks are very different indeed, but the first one is goa for me, while the second one is psychedelic techno. Ofc there is a world in between, it's a different (sub-) genre. Compare other goa tracks to Our Own Happiness.. they sound quite similar i.e. compare https://soundcloud.com/dataura/dataura-and-jebako-sample(Dataura) with https://soundcloud.com/chrisrich/chris-rich-shitty-rave-music-wip (Chris Rich). They're made by the same guy .. and 2 weeks separate these tracks, not years.. Edit: what I wanna say with it, is that you will hardly find lot of innovation on the same genre. They rather invent a new name for it, so listening to 'year 2000 fullon' for 10 years, it will become boring. Absolutly agree to that, but that's more because they guys that add lots of organic pads call it dark fullon, the ones that do a lot of FM call it underground fullon, the ones that do lot of blingbling-shot call it UK fullon and if one doesn't play a snaredrum it's darkpsy suddenly. You absolutly need to leave the known genres / artists if you are want hear innovate sound, same genre won't have a lot of innovation, won't be same genre anymore otherwise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filthysock Posted November 16, 2014 Share Posted November 16, 2014 I actually think it's possible to create a hell of a lot more innovation within the same (sub/)genre...At least, when I hear a lot of tracks I often think of all the things I would do to the track to make it more wicked, and I can imagine it vividly, and the way it sounds in my mind still allows for it to be in the same sub...Anyway, there are artists out there who effectively manage to innovate. Just look at what Posford is and always has been doing to Psy and Goa... he always took it a step deeper, and seemingly with ease. He just has the mind and touch for it... and instrumentation... he puts passion and time into it. Well, this has been my impression as far and long as I've been following his music.Also Prometheus seems to me to be of the same caliber. I don't know, you may be way past that and over used to it, for sure. But the potential is always there - within the same genre. You can tell when an artist is just having fun, being lazy, just wants to make sweet sounds... and when an artist truly wants to push the envelope - the latter is a lot more rare for sure.I'm sure you've checked out Psykovsky... that's not really my typical cup of tea... but I would easily lay on the carpet on a trip and swim into that wonderworld of audio craziness for that kind of occasion. It's pure art. It's completely something else, barely even music... it's just a pure artistic psychedelic experience.I generally listen to music while walking, skating, biking or working... so any of these modern Goa artists (Filteria, Lektro Spektral Daze, Crossing Mind, Khetzal) do it for me... I don't need it to be pushing the envelope per say... just tasty psychedelicness tickling the mind you know, Psykovsky would just be way too distracting for me... though I do always look out for the unexpected new experience within the Goa funk I surf upon... it's not always there, but it's ok... it still sounds good as hell... even when the sounds dont take me out of my mind, they still feel like mdma on my mind... every time a goa synth sound bends, oooohhh... it's just sexy...PS:Goa Gil by the way... old ass man who's been through all kinds of music... he said in an interview that Goa is the only genre that still stimulates him and which still evolves. Just kinda interesting to note that this old man feels that way... You would understand it if he were sick of it or were taking big breaks, but nope... he is lathered in it...But it's people who get tired of something that often end up being the innovators... so maybe you should get the instruments and make it happen... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richpa Posted November 16, 2014 Share Posted November 16, 2014 PS: Goa Gil by the way... old ass man who's been through all kinds of music... he said in an interview that Goa is the only genre that still stimulates him and which still evolves. Just kinda interesting to note that this old man feels that way... You would understand it if he were sick of it or were taking big breaks, but nope... he is lathered in it... Ummm that's really interesting, since he's promoting hi-tech music for a long time and it honestly doesn't have anything with Goa trance. Goa? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.