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You shall not steal


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Introduction:

 

This commandment has not been yet used on the forum according to the search, so this is a new discussion on the subject.

 

The main purpose is to help to determine for myself is it possible to listen to GOA trance music while living in a poor country regarding material values for it's inhabitants.

 

I grew up in a so called "3d world" country, which is Ukraine, an Eastern Europe, a post-Soviet Union country.

 

My main concern is whether it is possible to get enjoyment from the GOA trance music for the person, no matter where he lives but having a very minimum amount of what is called as "funds".

 

I've provided my growing/living location as an example where a lot of individuals might appear under circumstances, when they could not absolutely afford buying music so that it would feed their musical hunger.

 

Let's take a person who begun following the commandments absolutely, of the really the top priority.

For such a person, according to another well known saying, he would rather "cut off his ears but being able to enter the Divine Kingdom being a deaf instead of dead" and avoid the temptation.

 

Yes, "cutting off the ears" in one of the solutions. Another solution is to create your own music using the very limited hardware or listen to free music only which is available at the person's living location.

 

 

 

Question:

 

Another solution is to listen to the so called DJ sets and radio translations. And this is what I would like to discuss here.

I've seen there are people here who call themselves as "christians" and other similar-minded, so this discussion might be of the general benefit.

 

The situation appeared to be extremely difficult to solve! The main culprits here are the authors of the music who "agree to play labels game" and often enough create the same labels and the label managers themselves.

 

The fact that there are many of both producers and labels owners here was one of another reason for creation of this topic here.

 

One thing is certain here is that the commandment "You shall not steal" applies to the real thing, not what is say only written.

For example, an author never considered this issue at all and issues an album. On the CD it appeared to be written:

"..ALL RIGHTS OF THE MANUFACTURER AND OF THE OWNER OF THE RECORDED WORK RESERVED. UNAUTHORIZED PUBLIC PERFORMANCE, BROADCASTING AND COPYING OF THIS RECORD PROHIBITED." (Suntrip Records).

 

These are the words, but what lies behind the exact will of the author and the label?

Would they both mind of someone who could not really afford buying the album would be listening to a "pirated mp3"?

Because if the both music author and label owners in their "hearts" would normally accept the situation of giving the music to the materially poor people, it might not likely be the breaking of the commandment.

 

But who knows what lies inside of their "hearts"? I have created this thread in order to try to enlighten this mystery by listening to their official positions by a luck.

 

 

 

Another question is DJ mixes and radio broadcasts. It appeared to be that in my country (Ukraine) even now a lot of music which is being broadcasting live is using the "illegally downloaded" media!

For example, the latest Shpongle's album presentation several months ago was exactly this case!

 

At the same time, sometimes the authors themselves create music sets and give voice interviews for the same radio station, like it was in case with Goasia's "Dancing With The Blue Spirit" album and RA's mixset which was made just for the "party" which happened several days ago.

 

But, in the case when either a DJ mix is distributed over the internet or it is a radio broadcast from the "licensed media", it most most most of the cases, it is absolutely "not authorized".

 

And as I have already noted, there might be a real situation of the music authors and label owners wish: they might be absolutely tolerant for the situation where their music is included into a dj mix which is recorded from the purchased media or broadcasting on a radio station in a "3d world" country. Thus it might not be breaking of the commandment.

 

But as it is nowhere (maybe almost) said about what lies exactly behind the "copyright" law, at least absolutely nothing is said on both authors and labels web sites, I decided to try to clarify this question which worries me for such a long time already on this forum.

 

Thanks for the attention!

 

 

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Question:

 

Would they both mind of someone who could not really afford buying the album would be listening to a "pirated mp3"?

Because if the both music author and label owners in their "hearts" would normally accept the situation of giving the music to the materially poor people, it might not likely be the breaking of the commandment.

 

But who knows what lies inside of their "hearts"? I have created this thread in order to try to enlighten this mystery by listening to their official positions by a luck.

 

 

I want to buy CD to support artist/label but is impossible for my situation because i don't have job and for me is stupid to ask my parents to give me money to buy CD. They giving me enough. Plus psy/goa CDs are 4-5x more expansive then commercial CDs here (2-3 euro) so for our standards that means pretty expansive. 2 years i am searching for jobs but no luck, goverment don't do much to help about that.

 

Then i am used to download pirate mp3 but believe me i really want to have big collection of CDs.

 

 

When is about my music i am happy to share it with everyone, this way or another ofcourse if there is contract with label i respect terms. I don't see point if you don't share music with people, why are you making it then? If you want to live from music then make commercial shit and be Guetta on MTV.

 

I never rejected request for track for some VA because they don't want to pay. Most important thing for me that label keep me informed and to be honest, but yes money is welcome if possible. Just drop me few copies and i am happy :)

 

 

Don't know much about law for public media and buisness and i don't want too know. You mentioned Suntrip before, i worked with them twice i am more than happy. Professional, always fast replies, no delays, no crappy stories, contract respected by both sides. I met Mars last summer in Brussels and we spoke few hours. All i can see that he is positive and nice person. Other i can't comment because i dont know.

I ENJOY TO WORK WITH SUNTRIP.

 

 

IMO piracy have big part in promotion of material

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But as it is nowhere (maybe almost) said about what lies exactly behind the "copyright" law, at least absolutely nothing is said on both authors and labels web sites, I decided to try to clarify this question which worries me for such a long time already on this forum

 

The wording of copyright notices on music tend to be standard and based on the laws of the country the work was published in. Actual desires of the publisher or copyright holder can easily differ from what the wording sounds like.

 

The "Unauthorized public performance or broadcast" part of copyright law is intended for artists who are members of "performing rights organizations", which are organizations that collect money on behalf of their artists from radio stations or other people who play the music publicly. If a DJ mix were streamed, not available for download, that would fall under the "public performance" heading. I'm not sure if a downloadable mix would be considered a "copy" or not. If an artist is a member of such an organization, they expect to get paid for every public performance or broadcast of their music. I suppose, technically, an unauthorized broadcast would still be illegal even if the artist were not a member of a PRO, but I think most producers of this kind of music expect their music to end up in DJ mixes.

 

Whether a label or artist would mind you downloading a pirate MP3 because you can't afford a CD will differ from person to person probably. I'd venture to guess that yes, most will mind.

 

Are your questions on the legality or the morality of it?

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Interesting. I once thought of creating a topic directed to artists and labels called "Ripping off or oblivion?". I have a friend who mixed some tracks and posted in YT, with lots of viewings. Then one of the artists told him that he hadn't been asked to allow his track to be part of the setlist. My friend had to withdraw the mix from YT and did all again, minus the said track. Problem was, with or without being part of the DJ mix, the track was unknown, and also the artist. At least with the track he had the chance of having his track listened by more people.

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Me having a label i am really aware of piracy and it doesn't bother me much , neither does people sharing the music i have produced and composed on youtube . If people want to share it's because they love it and that is good . I'm not in this for the money anyway and if people really support us by buying our records , then , i will be happy to pay the artists for their kind work and invest in more Goa Trance music. :)

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Are your questions on the legality or the morality of it?

 

In the "Introduction" section of the topic I have tried to be as much clear with the attitude.

Of course, it is totally on the section of "morality", with the highest possible means. I thought this would be understood, especially, from mentioning the well known religion commandment as the name of the topic and the "cutting of the ears and entering the Divine being deaf but not dead" saying..

Thanks for the valuable replies so far.

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Me having a label i am really aware of piracy and it doesn't bother me much , neither does people sharing the music i have produced and composed on youtube . If people want to share it's because they love it and that is good . I'm not in this for the money anyway and if people really support us by buying our records , then , i will be happy to pay the artists for their kind work and invest in more Goa Trance music. :)

 

Well, i have spent alot of money for physical music from the age of 13, until 2-3 years ago, that the economic crisis has gone deeper here in the south.

 

Although, i have planned to purchase 4-5 releases from a shop in the capital city, since i can't buy music through the net anymore. And this had been always a problem for me, since the gone of the golden era of goa, where i could find cds in local music stores.

 

I think it is ok to download a pirated album only to listen to it, it helps more than the samples. But if you love an album then you have to buy it to support the artist and the production, moreover to obtain the whole piece of art.

 

There are artists that don't have a problem downloading their music, 'cause they believe that their music will be more known. And i think they're right. There are artists i discovered through file share.

 

I am not a psytrance artist but if i was, i think, i wouldn't expect to be able to live from it. More than trendy full-on, psytrance isn't a mainstream music.

All in all, it is the collector mystics that support original releases.

 

Now, mixsets should be free since there's no commercial gain. Or maybe it should be made in one only track or licensed under creative commons.

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Their are a some website that provide free goatrance, like ektoplazm.com ect,
and if people are in such a hunger for music which I understand, just download and don't care.
Even persons who spent enough money to the music production according their income would be able to download without worrying (off course how can they check that)
Giving max what you have is enough for a license to download imho...

And don't think that stopping all canals to download will make releases cheaper, music has been capitalized over the years,
And bands like metallica, brithey spears, the rolling stones etc etc ect have made billion of dollars for just releasing some great tunes...
I wasn't fair anymore, they fed on the hunger for music at the mob and now they are paying the bill... That's good!

They live in fucking castles, have 15 cars (who needs that?)

Just a shame for new small labels, they are getting punished for their ancestors capitalism pig behavior,

 

So when I buy new releases it's always from smaller labels.

 

On topic, you?

 

Download what you want my friend ;)

 

Downloading on the internet is like masturbating in real life,

Nobody does it,

But when the night fall comes they all do it anyway...

 

And some maybe buy all their music original, but then download every movie they have seen.
Others buy 50% music, 50% movies and they are the so called bad owns because they download music...

 

How many people have an illegal windows installed, Microsoft office?

That's suddenly ok?

 

Download according to your income/month, spend/according to your income (wife, kids etc...)

 

And sleep with your both ears on your pillow...

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After the latest discovery, the situation seems to be not that bad, after all:

1. There is a lot of really good free music and always have been.
2. Music is not that expensive and becomes more and more cheaper due to increased amounts of the legal ways of availability including:
- cheap mp3 stores
- second hand stores
- full length preview services (bandcamp), sometimes with custom playlists ability (myspace, soundcloud via API)
- free/little monthly fee payment online streaming services (spotify, deezer, rhapsody) including various local ones (music.yandex.ru)

I would also like to mention separately the last from the list method of providing the content: online streaming services. Some of them seem to be having really good content, cheap/free price. I will make a short review below based on the availability of some goa-trance artists and available for streaming at least in Ukraine.

Deezer.com

Price: 3.49€/month

Intro: A french web site with worldwide availability serving about 20 millions of tracks.

Content:

Zirrex - Lost In Time

Transwave - Frontfire

Transwave - Phototropic

Electric Universe - newer albums

Suntrip discography

Dimensional records discography

Bottom: Seem to be a 100% legal having a nice amount of goa tracks, almost all that are available through online stores, but not all though. Maybe the cheapest price from all paid ones.

 

 

Rhapsody.com (ex. Napster)

Price: $9.99/month

Intro: An ex Napster with large enough database

Content:

No difference from the previous site.

Bottom: About the same as previous site but with a but higher price. No older "Electric Universe" albums which are available at some major online stores.

 

 

Grooveshark.com

Price: Free

Intro: A US. based free service with worldwide availability and making able to users to upload their content

Content:

All of the listed previously included plus older EU albums: "One Love" and "Stardiver".

Also includes albums like Miranda-Phenomena, Transwave-Helium, Flyring Rhino discography and others alike.

Bottom: Seems to providing the most large content amount, but it's legibility is a question! It contains a lot of albums from defunct. labels and allows anyone to upload any material which instantly becomes available to everyone, which surely causes the very high risk of piracy. However, the company seem to be willing to rather creating new deals with copyright owners and paying them the needed amounts rather than removing music from the streaming.

 

 

music.yandex.ru

Price: Free

Intro: A free streaming service available only in: Russia, Ukraine, Kazakhstan

Content:

Zirrex - nothing

Transwave - Frontfire

Transwave - Phototropic

Electric Universe - newer albums, "One Love", "Stardiver"

Suntrip - nothing, [Edit] but "Crossing Mind - Inner Shift"

Dimensional records - nothing

Bottom: The database is much less from the paid ones like deezer and rhapsody, but growing and still big enough. Also contains some albums which are not available there. Absolutely free and legal, my obvious choice for the moment! :)

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  • 2 weeks later...

Internet=music.

Thats how it works for majority of folks word wide and money, slowly, but irreversibly is losing its role in distribution of music to the masses.

Soon yall will listen to music for free, bet it pop or underground :D!

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  • 2 weeks later...

music.yandex.ru

 

Price: Free

Intro: A free streaming service available only in: Russia, Ukraine, Kazakhstan

Content:

Zirrex - nothing

Transwave - Frontfire

Transwave - Phototropic

Electric Universe - newer albums, "One Love", "Stardiver"

Suntrip - nothing, [Edit] but "Crossing Mind - Inner Shift"

Dimensional records - nothing

Bottom: The database is much less from the paid ones like deezer and rhapsody, but growing and still big enough. Also contains some albums which are not available there. Absolutely free and legal, my obvious choice for the moment! :)

 

that's an illegal Russian site my friend, most latest releases are their online to download in flac or mp3 ;)

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This discussion has already taken place.

 

e: Also, this.

 

If so why can I download it without a problem from Belgium???

Even my email address is Belgium and so is my IP...

No proxies what so ever...

And I know a guy from france who can log in and just download like without using other channels...

Sorry I don't buy it, I agree to disagree with respect ;)

, I have told and will repeat here, that the music content is available only for 3 countries: Russia, Ukraine, Kazakhstan and only for streaming using their site (including mobile version).

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If so why can I download it without a problem from Belgium???

Even my email address is Belgium and so is my IP...

No proxies what so ever...

And I know a guy from france who can log in and just download like without using other channels...

Sorry I don't buy it, I agree to disagree with respect ;)

 

Then you are definitely missing http://music.yandex.ru with some other site. Here, no downloads are allowed - only streaming but including mobile devices support.

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Then you are definitely missing http://music.yandex.ru with some other site. Here, no downloads are allowed - only streaming but including mobile devices support.

 

That's indeed a different site, well not's fight over this, I'm probably mixing them up, therefor I apologize :)

Those links all look the same, but I checked it and some letters are different... My mistake again ;)

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