krelmatrix Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 i think x-dream is more responsible for bringing the full-on basslines... they were the first to have huge basslines as well... I've always thought the same thing. I remember when the Microchip EP came out in '97 or so, with those massive basslines in "Coming Soon" and "Intercorporal Stimulator"....as far as I remember, those were the first tunes I heard with the really bass-driven sound (yes, even if it's not 16th note basslines) which is the signature of full-on nowadays. At the time, I thought it sounded kind of awkward, but it seemed to catch on. Gawd, I remember the nice days in '98-2001 when the full-on sound (I referred to it more as "cybertrance" at the time since I thought it had a very cyber metalllic sound to it) was still somewhat of a unique sound coming from some Frenchies and a couple Israeli guys named Ofer & Avi. The Tandu album, the Pigs in Space album and a couple of the Space Cat albums were absolutely brilliant. Same goes for a lot of the stuff that came out on 3d Vision in the early days. Then TIPWorld caught on and it seemed to become a fad sometime around 2001. I know Mike Verros (The mafios of Athens) was especially fond of this style of music and the endless many Israeli artists and DJ's he booked every wekeend. That's a flash back - one of the first goa records I bought when I started DJing was from his Psychonauts project - the Olympus/Journey Into Time EP back in 1996. It was weird but cool. I'm guessing it was before his downfall into cheese. u are talking about israeli music... ok. israeli music is california sunshine, MFG, sandman, (huge respected artists) can u find anything bad to these projects?? Ah, the days when the term "Israeli Trance" meant something special....there is still good music coming from the country (Domo/Ear Peaks kicks serious ass), but in '96-99 I was seriously digging most of the stuff coming from Israeli labels & Artists (crappy Nitzhonot stuff excluded). California Sunshine, MFG, Astral Projection, Power Source, Space Cat, Oforia....really fantastic stuff. I remember regularly playing sets of mostly Israeli melodic stuff for a year or two. Sometimes i think you have so much to say against Israel that you'll even say bad words about the local toilets. Well, if you'd just clean the damned things once in awhile.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
airic Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 This may sound dumb but i like all good psytrance music whatever subgenre it is....too hard sometimes to clarify just tune it in and dance around! peace and love....airic... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tatsu Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 ... Ah, the days when the term "Israeli Trance" meant something special....there is still good music coming from the country (Domo/Ear Peaks kicks serious ass), but in '96-99 I was seriously digging most of the stuff coming from Israeli labels & Artists (crappy Nitzhonot stuff excluded). California Sunshine, MFG, Astral Projection, Power Source, Space Cat, Oforia....really fantastic stuff. I remember regularly playing sets of mostly Israeli melodic stuff for a year or two. Well, if you'd just clean the damned things once in awhile.... 583666[/snapback] Oh yes, those were the days. Isrealy music was tha shit (meant in a positive way) when I came to this scene. It was more about artists like Psysex with their first album, Infected with their second one, Yahel with Waves Of Sound but of course also Space Cat and so on. Too bad I just cought the last wave, not much later the melodies were gone and it was all about minimal/progressive. You can for sure imagine my disappointment when I attended parties and the music was more and more changing towards something I really disliked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krell Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 I've always thought the same thing. I remember when the Microchip EP came out in '97 or so, with those massive basslines in "Coming Soon" and "Intercorporal Stimulator"....as far as I remember, those were the first tunes I heard with the really bass-driven sound (yes, even if it's not 16th note basslines) which is the signature of full-on nowadays. At the time, I thought it sounded kind of awkward, but it seemed to catch on. 583666[/snapback] You are mistaken. The Microchip EP came out in 1999, one of the most overplayed tracks at the VooV Experience that year, along with Paps "Vibes from the Other Side / Digital Ache". Those FOUR tracks where played again and again..... "Vibes from the other Side" being very dark and aggressive. (Tracks that changed the sound of the scene if you ask me). Also, there was Children of Parardise' s first album "Urban Alien", released 1999 which also cemented the "chopper bass", but I dont think that was so much related to full on as such, since it seemed a bit more laid back in attitude (Full On is, after all, all about attitude and not whether its a 16th bassline or not). While Children of Paradise was more melodic and traditional, the microchip EP was more techie and the Paps EP went into darkness, aggression and a bit of Tech also. I can find stereotypical Full On basslines from before that time, and I even believe I have some earlier Quick tracks with a typical 16th note bassline from their first album "Machina Electrica & Fornax Chemica " released in 1998 if I dont remember wrong. Tim Schuldt released some also around 1998 on the Aurinko Records debut compilation "Score", I think. (btw, Im not taking this from long term memory, I listened thru my entire CD collection not long ago, noting all this stuff) :-) Other than that, there was the first Oforia album "Delirious" released 1998 on Dragonfly. An album representing a whole new sound and production quality, taking most people by storm. Go listen to that album, and compare it to newer Full On, it sounds very alike. For me, the huuuuge basslines was actually the trademark of Astral Projection, I think it was a big factor in their success to be able to make much fatter basslines than their peers at the same time. Listen to their "Trust In Trance" album release 1996 and compare it to what was else there. My experience here from Denmark was first that Israeli Trance identifified the power driven israeli goa/psy variety, laced with ethnic melodies and pumping bass. That was the recipe to make people groove back then... but, with time, it just become cliche and it all sounded the same. As soon as that happened, Israeli Trance was = todays Full On in regards to how people viewed the genre. Of course now, Israeli Trance, is just what people call Goa Trance.. they were not there, so, its easier to comprehend. BUT I KNOW BETTER NO MATTER WHAT ANYONE SAYS *takes some pills to calm down again* :-) - Krell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krelmatrix Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 You are mistaken. The Microchip EP came out in 1999, Whichever year....I knew it was sometime in the late-90s. Fortunately, there were few enough DJs in Texas at the time with diverse enough tastes that we didn't get any tracks ground into our heads over and over again at a particular event. Whatever the case, I remember hearing those tracks and thinking that they were completely different from everything I had been hearing for the last years. The bassline was much more in the forefront with the rest of the track following than most anything I had heard to that point. I didn't really like it at the time....or it sounded somehow strange to me. However, I remember when I started hearing some of the 3d vision stuff that had more of a melodic structure along with the huge basslines that it somehow clicked...especially that first Talamasca album. It almost seemed to combine that bass-dominated sound with what Ofer Dikovsky had done with the Pigs in Space and Delirious albums. IMO, the full-on sound hit its peak in 2000-2001, then got really boring and formulaic afterwards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krell Posted August 9, 2006 Share Posted August 9, 2006 Whichever year....I knew it was sometime in the late-90s. Fortunately, there were few enough DJs in Texas at the time with diverse enough tastes that we didn't get any tracks ground into our heads over and over again at a particular event. Whatever the case, I remember hearing those tracks and thinking that they were completely different from everything I had been hearing for the last years. The bassline was much more in the forefront with the rest of the track following than most anything I had heard to that point. I didn't really like it at the time....or it sounded somehow strange to me. However, I remember when I started hearing some of the 3d vision stuff that had more of a melodic structure along with the huge basslines that it somehow clicked...especially that first Talamasca album. It almost seemed to combine that bass-dominated sound with what Ofer Dikovsky had done with the Pigs in Space and Delirious albums. IMO, the full-on sound hit its peak in 2000-2001, then got really boring and formulaic afterwards. 583834[/snapback] I agree, the Microchip EP marked a change in the sound. It was a continuation of the Minimal/Tech sound BUT it was combined with much more power in the bassline. The same can be said for the Paps EP released at the same time, once more one side was tech and the other side quite aggressive & dark. I remember the Paps stuff becoming VERY popular in my area, with the emergence of Creamcrop Records who supported the rising Minimal Psy trend as well as giving some energy to the establishment of Dark Psy. Before Parvati Records was established, the people behind the label organized outdoor events, stuff like Paps "Vibes from the Other side" was played there, along with Aether, Ect, Hux Flux etc. Putting those sounds together, the dark minimal sound, featured by Paps, Magus and many more and the more organic and quirky sound by huxflux, ect, aether etc gave birth to Dark Psy - Or at least, it must have been a strong inspirational source for the artists evolving around Parvati Records. In this I suggest that both Parvati Records and Creamcrop Records, which are/were both based in my town, have had a huge influence on the sound they represented (In no way Full On though). However, I think "Full On" is more of a reaction to the emergence of strong "dance floor killarrghhs" like "Coming Soon", "Intercorporal Stimulator", "Digital Ache" and so forth, than it is a continuation of that style. After all, 3D Vision released its first compilation also in 1999, which featured a very full on sound - A full on attitude with many melodies and a fast pace... not really relaxing, and not really minimal stuff either... This is also why I suggest that Full On does not build on the Tech sound of X-dream and Paps - but it does react to it. Also, it is born as a genre in its own right at aproximately the same time (which I think is why you come to your conclusion, since you put 2 and 2 together). Remember - What prompted the need for the description "Full On", in the first place, was the need to differentiate between Minimal/Progressive Psy and the more stereotypical Melodic & Break/Climax driven trance. Untill the two "Minimal(later progressive)" and "Full On" became established norms, people would go to events and complain about the music wasnt what they expected. Either because they were fed up with the cliche formula and wanted the new tech sound, or because they couldnt relate to the new tech sound and wanted the good old formula. We began more and more to see what was essentially "Full On Floor" & "Minimal/Progressive Floor". Where it had previously just been one floor. Then, like now, there were debates - "Minimal Tech is NOT psy / goa" / and "Goa is BORING, no evolution, Minimal Psy is the future!" etc. So - I dont think, as such, that Full On would be building on stuff like X-Dream´s Microchip EP (since they were sort of 2 opposites inside the same spectrum). However, I do agree that "Full On" would need to react to it, since the sound of the scene at that time was becoming divided and both directions needed to evolve if they wanted to have their place at the lineups. Full On builds on Oforia, Tandu, Pleidians, Infected Mushroom, Tim Schuldt and stuff like that. Progressive builds on X-Dream, Planet BEN, Organic Noise, Tristan, Montauk P and that stuff. Dark Psy is born from the combination of older organic psy like Hux Flux, Ect, Aether etc in combination with the dark & aggressive released by Paps, The Delta, Snug as a Bug, Magus and so forth. But ok, if you still feel convinced X-Dream "Coming Soon" is at the base of the Full On sound, then I dont think I can conjure up any more arguments :-) At least we can agree on one thing, and that is that the "Full On" term began becoming an established norm at the same time (its infancy). Or at least I think we agree there :-) - Krell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andonis Posted December 13, 2006 Share Posted December 13, 2006 I don't remember hearing the infamous 16th-note bassline before Headware. I might be imagining this. I think you're right. This has been the first time I heard that sound too. Haven't heard the other old stuff (Oforia, X-Dream) mentioned here though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simorq Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I'm resurrecting this old thread because I'm curious who it was that was posting as the guest "Guest_Elysium_*" Anybody know, I wanted to check him out. Interesting thread anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abasio Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I'm resurrecting this old thread because I'm curious who it was that was posting as the guest "Guest_Elysium_*" Anybody know, I wanted to check him out. Interesting thread anyway. Elysium Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simorq Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 Elysium Wow, do I feel stupid now Thanks (discogs is the shit, btw) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GagaISM Posted October 15, 2011 Share Posted October 15, 2011 I agree, the Microchip EP marked a change in the sound. It was a continuation of the Minimal/Tech sound BUT it was combined with much more power in the bassline. The same can be said for the Paps EP released at the same time, once more one side was tech and the other side quite aggressive & dark. I remember the Paps stuff becoming VERY popular in my area, with the emergence of Creamcrop Records who supported the rising Minimal Psy trend as well as giving some energy to the establishment of Dark Psy. Before Parvati Records was established, the people behind the label organized outdoor events, stuff like Paps "Vibes from the Other side" was played there, along with Aether, Ect, Hux Flux etc. Putting those sounds together, the dark minimal sound, featured by Paps, Magus and many more and the more organic and quirky sound by huxflux, ect, aether etc gave birth to Dark Psy - Or at least, it must have been a strong inspirational source for the artists evolving around Parvati Records. In this I suggest that both Parvati Records and Creamcrop Records, which are/were both based in my town, have had a huge influence on the sound they represented (In no way Full On though). However, I think "Full On" is more of a reaction to the emergence of strong "dance floor killarrghhs" like "Coming Soon", "Intercorporal Stimulator", "Digital Ache" and so forth, than it is a continuation of that style. After all, 3D Vision released its first compilation also in 1999, which featured a very full on sound - A full on attitude with many melodies and a fast pace... not really relaxing, and not really minimal stuff either... This is also why I suggest that Full On does not build on the Tech sound of X-dream and Paps - but it does react to it. Also, it is born as a genre in its own right at aproximately the same time (which I think is why you come to your conclusion, since you put 2 and 2 together). Remember - What prompted the need for the description "Full On", in the first place, was the need to differentiate between Minimal/Progressive Psy and the more stereotypical Melodic & Break/Climax driven trance. Untill the two "Minimal(later progressive)" and "Full On" became established norms, people would go to events and complain about the music wasnt what they expected. Either because they were fed up with the cliche formula and wanted the new tech sound, or because they couldnt relate to the new tech sound and wanted the good old formula. We began more and more to see what was essentially "Full On Floor" & "Minimal/Progressive Floor". Where it had previously just been one floor. Then, like now, there were debates - "Minimal Tech is NOT psy / goa" / and "Goa is BORING, no evolution, Minimal Psy is the future!" etc. So - I dont think, as such, that Full On would be building on stuff like X-Dream´s Microchip EP (since they were sort of 2 opposites inside the same spectrum). However, I do agree that "Full On" would need to react to it, since the sound of the scene at that time was becoming divided and both directions needed to evolve if they wanted to have their place at the lineups. Full On builds on Oforia, Tandu, Pleidians, Infected Mushroom, Tim Schuldt and stuff like that. Progressive builds on X-Dream, Planet BEN, Organic Noise, Tristan, Montauk P and that stuff. Dark Psy is born from the combination of older organic psy like Hux Flux, Ect, Aether etc in combination with the dark & aggressive released by Paps, The Delta, Snug as a Bug, Magus and so forth. But ok, if you still feel convinced X-Dream "Coming Soon" is at the base of the Full On sound, then I dont think I can conjure up any more arguments :-) At least we can agree on one thing, and that is that the "Full On" term began becoming an established norm at the same time (its infancy). Or at least I think we agree there :-) - Krell Sorry for brining this old thread back to life, but I think this post is worth reading for those who haven't. Interesting perspective. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abasio Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 Aye, Krell was a good poster. Didn't post much but it was usually worth reading. Also, a thread with Elysium, The Journey Man Project AND Rezwanker. Something to be savoured. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ormion Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 Ahh, those where the days. When making a full on thread meant WAR! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zebra Xing Posted October 21, 2011 Share Posted October 21, 2011 The first full on I can remember is stuff like the 3D vision double cd comp - Psychedelic, along with stuff like Tandu/Oforia & especially GMS... this was all around 1998. Re: Logic Bomb, they were always more prog/minimal/darker... when Headware came out it was a crossover into a style that was already developing. Only full on album that I reckon had some legs was Altom - Hologram. I remember learning to avoid full on parties as 12 hours of similar baselines was turture. Worst full-on memory was a sunrise 4 hour Talamasca set that seemed like the same song until lunchtime. (sorry to any 'tala' fans...but pretty sure he was miming on a nord lead that wasnt plugged in also lol) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sideffect... Posted October 21, 2011 Share Posted October 21, 2011 I have to admit, I really like full on it makes me feel happy... I think full on is actually really classy music hehe Fullon is pretty ok, but there was a certain period of, how would I say it, overproduction, with the result that there is to much crap. And it's hard to find decent work like 'the misted muppet, principles of flight etc..." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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