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Abandontrace


Taika-Kim
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I have had an idea for a long time now about a site that would collect old obsolete vinyl releases for everybody to download.

 

I, for example would SO much like to hear the first Mindfield & Infinity Project EPs around 1991-3.

 

I don't think this would damage anybody's franchise since commercially these tracks are completely outdated and the pressings are long gone, too.

 

There's so much good stuff out there that will otherwise be LOST forever to some obscure vinyl collections as records are lost & broken little by little. In a hundred year's time, this culture & the tunes we created will be lost if we continue like this...

This music deserves to be preserved and enjoyed!

 

Any thoughts about this anybody? Artists? Labelpeople?

 

How about practically? Do you think there would be problems with the copyright owners? Most of the labels are defunct, and I don't believe the artists themselves would want to interfere with people sharing their old music?

 

I haven't been in touch with any labels or artists yet, but I'm planning to. I just wanted to know, if there's interest in this.

My problem of course is, that I don't have an vinyl collection and I can't do webpage design. But I could volunteer for the PR person who keeps in touch with the artists/ other copyright owners. And I could also donate server space. I think a torrent site would be the most sensible, but continuity is a problem always when people stop seeding... So in the beginning it could be just a download site, our homepage has something like 40gig quota, of which we use maybe 5% :P

 

This kind of system has been working for oooold computer games for many years, as long as the titles are considered obsolete, and are no more sold, the companies seem to have adopted a rather friendly approach.

Check out for example : http://www.the-underdogs.org/

 

Parallel discussion: http://www.psy-forum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=37467

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I'm all for it, of course... I would suggest you go with BT from the very start though, and take some care to write about each vinyl in historical context.

 

As long as you keep to truly abandoned releases I don't see what the problem could be... no one's losing out.

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I'm 100% pro also

 

but as said here, probably some people, that had to look years for certain cds/vinyls will not easily share it... But if you have any real plans, let me know, I'm willing to help as your point is véry true

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im 100% for it taika kim, i dont have vinyl tho :)

 

i think most collectors will think like "Oh no i am not sharing my vinyl"

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yes, those bastards :(:rolleyes::angry:

 

I'll share what I have that others don't. Sadly I have no vinyls at all.

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i bet some rare cds we be wellcome too :)

 

yes, there are plenty of old tracks that cant be traced even trough p2p softs, or they are available there but in some semi secret places.

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Well if some collectors don't like to share because they payed a lot for some album, it's a problem of their ego, it has nothing to do with the real world. It's not like they're losing, unless they believe in a "zero-sum" game of happiness, ie. the amount of Good in the universe is a constant. These kind of beliefs were common in medieval times in Europe.

This kind of attitude really makes me angry, really! I think it's really selfish. Technically it's pretty understandable since in their mode of thought they will be losing prestige if releases that previously were exclusively in ther possession are suddenly available to anybody, but again, this is a bit tribal, I think that if the accumulation of matter is the most important way of gaining social recognition/ self-esteem to anybody, they have a problem in their hands... Then again, I'm just a dirty hippie, maybe there's just something I'm missing :/

 

Completely another game is the fact that making vinyl transfers is a lot of work, I can see that many people are not going to spend their free time doing it for nothing.

 

Hmm, but BT... Isn't it really a problem if people just stop seeding? I'm not very familiar with torrents. Is there a way to ensure the availability of files?

 

And yes! That's exactly what I thought: making some kind of information also available about each release so it wouldn't be just a leech site.

 

Nice to see that I'm not alone in being worried about great releases fading into obscurity...

 

I also didn't mean to necessarily have a ton of files, at least in the beginnig, but especially focus on _interesting_ releases.

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i have a few old early 90s EPs but most of them can be found through p2p anyways...

i could upload some of them though if you want it to be more available.

408946[/snapback]

"rip" them in wav to your pc :D

then encode 320Kbps :)

 

EDIT :

 

etnica - alien protein 3xLP

 

D1 Still Botta (7:21)

 

wtf B) ?!

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the point of collecting is having the actual item... it would just be good for every music interested person if the people who have the vinyls would upload them for free, just as emulators and games from the 80's have been shared publicly. the files themselves have no collectors value.

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I've been thinking about the possible technical side... I think we for example have 1.6 terabytes/mohth available for downloading, so even a direct download site might work, I can imagine it takes a while to get above that even if many people are downloading...

 

Then: have a forum somewhere (even here on Psynews?) for the sharing, and have an own thread for every release there, with both a direct download link and a torrent link? It would be easy to add releases and talk about them there, and there would be no need for any centralised server.

 

The idea is to have a database of those releases that are approved for this kind of free distribution by the artists/labels, so that people could just host the files where ever they want.

And, in general, I don't like the idea of any one/few people having decisive power over _any_ communal activity.

 

I don't like the idea of one centralised site, there's always the problem of everything going down if the people behind it get tired, or abandon the project for some other reason...

 

OK, coming up next: what the artists have to say about this. I'm trying to get in touch with some labels...

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Well, I mailed Phantasm yesterday, but the ebvious problem is that most old labels are dead... Symbiosis & Celtic records were for example great, but both are folded.

And would I think megalabels like Dragonfly & TIP:World would be opposed to this anyway, I'm not sure how pro scene they are anymore... Should still try to mail them I think, they're some of the few remaining pioneers.

 

I have no idea where to get contact information for artists so this is a bit hard...

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This sounds like a very good idea to me. But you should really ask every label before putting their releases online. The Underdogs once got a lot of problems when they put something online without permission. That game was very old and sold out but some game company still owning the rights sued them. You should know there is always some greedy bastard just waiting to sue you. Dont put anything online without the explicit agreement of the owner of the rights or you could get into trouble. Sad thing this mostly happens to those with the greatest dedication to the community...

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Well, I mailed Phantasm yesterday, but the ebvious problem is that most old labels are dead... Symbiosis & Celtic records were for example great, but both are folded.

And would I think megalabels like Dragonfly & TIP:World would be opposed to this anyway, I'm not sure how pro scene they are anymore... Should still try to mail them I think, they're some of the few remaining pioneers.

 

I have no idea where to get contact information for artists so this is a bit hard...

409764[/snapback]

raja will rob you, try to find graham wood :)
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Can you please wait until I have sold all my rare vinyls on e-bay?

 

I need the cash :)

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If you are actually selling some of your stuff, would you care to send me a list with what you got. Maybe I would buy some stuff when I get my next salary. If not, just forget it...

 

Anyway, this idea is great. I do have a lot of vinyls and I would immediately share them. Unfortunately I don't have the technical ability to rip them. Besides that I also think I don't have that much rare stuff. At least not rare stuff in the sense of music no longer beeing available. But this project is just great, I really like the idea behind it.

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Well, people, start asking around ;)

 

I have 0 contacts with any old non-finnish trance artists, so my usefulness to the project is limited.

 

I think if somebody gets some permissions, we could just make a forum for these releases here, and I could provide the server space if needed, we have a lot, and bandwidth too...

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Well if some collectors don't like to share because they payed a lot for some album, it's a problem of their ego, it has nothing to do with the real world. It's not like they're losing, unless they believe in a "zero-sum" game of happiness, ie. the amount of Good in the universe is a constant. These kind of beliefs were common in medieval times in Europe.

This kind of attitude really makes me angry, really! I think it's really selfish.

Music copyright belongs to an artist. They may license a track to a label, which is allowed to distribute the music for a specified period (dependant on their contract). Once this period lapses, the label is no longer allowed to continue distribution of the music and the artist becomes the sole owner.

 

So it's really only fair to ask for the artists permission, since it is their art. They may already be in discussions to secure a deal with a digital label, or may plan to do so. Most artists will still have the original digital copies of their audio, so we can presume they will be happy to share an encode of the original rather than a vinyl rip (for all you audiophiles :) ).

 

I think the best solution would be to agree on a basic contract with each artist to license their music for digital distribution, either for free or a small per unit fee. Accounting, forming & discussing basic contracts, obtaining digital copies & the relevant metadata can take some time. And then you have to create & maintain a platform to share the music.

 

The easiest option would be to only share music from artists who donate (that that may mean no GMS ;-) their music, tho a contract still really needs to be drawn up. Wouldn't want to step on any big labels feet, who may actually still own the copyright!

 

I will speak to the guys at my company, since we specialise in digital music distribution to itunes / napster etc :-) I've also created / maintain a few online shops for digital downloads & physical sales for independent labels & artists (paper recordings, far out recordings, magic & accidental, coil's threshold house & a few in development)

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